Vedas,yoga and meditation - Page 2

Rashmi · 10-16-2007, 01:33 AM

Thank you hubert for your words of appreciation.Infact i daily read the biographies of these perfect masters, to keep me on the path of astanga yoga and veda.This knowledge belongs to humanity, given by God to four rishis of unsexual creation Agni Aaditya, Angira and Vayu at the begining of this creation.There First disciple was brahma.the guru shishya parampara started by brahma is continuing since then.My efforts are to alievate the darknes or misconceptions in the mind of all the practitioners of astanga yoga regarding vedas/yoga by quoting the examples of these perfect masters.And to make you understand the spirituality of Yoga, its origination, which will benefit all.On the path of yoga and devotion to god i have gained this knowledge.
These perfect masters will guide you in your journey of self realisation depending on your faith, devotion and steadfastness if you pray to them.indian mind is devoted due to spiritual vibrations.But in this age of darkness(kaliyug) truth is distorted and we have to dispel this darkness from our minds.as and when time permits these jewels of wisdom by these siddha yogis.

om

Rashmi · 10-16-2007, 10:26 PM

Dear friends,
namaste,
we often discuss in this forum regarding Guru. in this regard we should always listen to vedas and brahma Gyani.Brahma means God. One who himself after preach of vedas, practice of astanga yoga has realised self and god is called brahma Gyani.God reveals himself to others through these brahma gyanis and Gurus.Further what to read regarding spiritual emancipation ,vedas and shastras, commenties by mantradrishta rishis and brahma gyanis to be read .Due to internet/printing press the knowledge Given by our mantradrishta rishis is now available to us, read it .Those brahma gyanis, philosopher of vedas and yoga have left these valuable knowledge in the form of sutras. If possible do acquire knowledge of sanskrit which is a divine language and mother of all language.Never get disheartened be steadfast in practice of Yoga. God is called athiti in vedas you never know when he plesed with you and reveal you, but you have to sincere urge to seek him.Now the grace of guru by sai baba of shirdi:

Mrs. Radhabai Deshmukh
There was an old woman by name Radhabai, She was the mother of one Khashaba Deshmukh. Hearing Baba's fame, she came to Shirdi with the people of Sangamner. She took Baba's darshan and was much satisfied. She loved Baba intimately and resolved in her mind, that She should accept Baba as her Guru, and take some Upadesh from Him. She knew nothing else. She determined to fast herself unto death, so long as Baba did not accept her, and give her any Upadesh or Mantra. She stayed in her lodging and left off taking any food or water for three days. I was frightened by this ordeal of the old woman, and interceded with Baba on her behalf. I said, "Deva, what is this You have started? You drag so many persons here. You know that old lady. She is very obstinate and depends on You entirely, She has resolved to fast unto death, if You don't accept and instruct her. If any thing worse happens, people will blame You, and say that Baba did not instruct her, and consequently she met her death. So take some mercy on her, bless her and instruct her." On seeing her determination, Baba sent for her, changed the turn of her mind by addressing her as follows:-
"Oh mother, why are you subjecting yourself to unnecessary tortures and hastening your death? You are really My Mother and I am your child. Take pity on Me and hear Me through. I tell you My own story, which if you listen carefully, will do you good. I had a Guru. He was a great Saint and most merciful. I served him long, very long; still he would not blow any Mantra into My ears. I had a keen desire, never to leave him but to stay with and serve him; and at all costs receive some instructions from him. But he had his own way. He first got my head shaved and asked Me two pice as Dakshina. I gave the same at once. If you say that as My Guru was perfect, why should he ask for money and how should he be called desireless? I replied plainly that he never cared for coins. What had he to do with them? His two pice were (1) Firm Faith and (2) Patience or perseverance. I gave these two pice or things to him, and he was pleased.

Om

Rashmi · 10-16-2007, 10:29 PM

"I resorted to My Guru for 12 years. He brought Me up. There was no dearth of food and clothing. He was full of love nay, he was love incarnate. How can I describe it? He loved Me most. Rare is a Guru like him. When I looked at him, he seemed as if he was in deep meditation, and then we both were filled with Bliss. Night and day, I gazed at him with no thought of hunger and thirst. Without him, I felt restless. I had no other object to meditate, nor any other thing than My Guru to attend. He was My sole refuge. My mind was always fixed on him. This is one pice Dakshina. Saburi (Patience or perseverance) is the other pice. I waited patiently and very long on My Guru and served him. This Saburi will ferry you across the sea of this mundane existence. Saburi is manliness in man, it removes all sins and afflictions, gets rid of calamities in various ways, and casts aside all fear, and ultimately gives you success. Saburi is the mine of virtues, consort of good thought. Nishtha (Faith) and Saburi (Patience) are like twin sisters, loving each other very intimately."
"My Guru never expected any other thing from Me. He never neglected Me, but protected Me at all times. I lived with him, and was sometimes away from him; still I never felt the want or absence of his love. He always protected Me by his glance, just as the tortoise feeds her young ones, whether they are near her or away from her on the other side of the river bank, by her loving looks. Oh mother, My Guru never taught Me any Mantra, then how shall I blow any Mantra in your ears? Just remember that Guru's tortoise-like loving glance gives us happiness. Do not try to get Mantra or Upadesh from anybody. Make Me the sole object of your thoughts and actions; and you will, no doubt, attain Paramartha (the spiritual goal of life). Look at Me whole-heartedly, and I in turn look at you similarly. Sitting in this Masjid, I speak the truth, nothing but the truth. No Sadhanas, nor proficiency in the six Shastras, are necessary. Have faith and confidence in your Guru. Believe fully, that Guru is the sole Actor or Doer. Blessed is he who knows the greatness of his Guru and thinks him to be Hari, Hara and Brahma (Trimurti) Incarnate."
Instructed in this way, the old lady was convinced; she bowed to Baba and gave up her fast.
Hearing this story carefully and attentively, and marking its significance and appropriateness, Hemadpant was most agreeably surprised. Seeing this wonderful Leela of Baba, he was moved from top to toe, he was overflowing with joy, his throat was choked, and he was not able to utter a single word. Shama, on seeing him in this condition asked him, - "What is the matter with you, why are you silent? How many innumerable Leelas of Baba shall I describe!"

Then Baba spoke as follows:- "My method is quite unique. Remember well, this one story, and it will be very useful. To get the knowledge (realization) of the Self, Dhyana (meditation) is necessary. If you practice it continuously, the Vrittis (thoughts) will be pacified. Being quite desireless, you should meditate on the Lord, Who is in all the creatures, and when the mind is concentrated, the goal will be achieved. Meditate always on My formless nature, which is knowledge incarnate, consciousness and bliss. If you cannot do this, meditate on My Form from top to toe as you see here night and day. As you go on doing this, your Vrittis will concentrate on one point and the distinction between the Dhyata (meditator), Dhyana (act of meditation), Dhyeya (this meditated upon) will be lost and the meditator will be one with the Consciousness and be merged in the Brahman. The (mother) tortoise is on one bank of the river, and her young ones are on the other side. She gives neither milk, nor warmth to them. Her mere glance gives them nutrition. The young ones do nothing, but remember (meditate upon) their mother. The tortoise glance is, to the young ones, a down-pour of nectar, the only source of sustenance and happiness. Similar is the relation, between the Guru and disciples."
When Baba uttered these last words, the chorus of the Arati songs stopped and all cried out loudly in one voice: "Victory be to our Sadguru Sai Maharaj, Who is Existence, Knowledge and Bliss." Dear readers, let us imagine, that we are at this time, standing amongst the crowd in the Masjid; and let us join them in this Jayajayakar.
After the Arati ceremony was over, Prasad was distributed. Bapusaheb Jog advanced as usual, and after saluting Baba, gave into His hand a handful of sugar-candy. Baba pushed all this quantity into the hands of Hemadpant and said to him, "If you take this story to heart and remember it well, your state will be sweet as the sugar-candy, all your desires will be fulfilled and you will be happy." Hemadpant bowed before Baba and implored, "Do favour me like this, bless and protect me always." Baba replied - "Hear this story, meditate on it and assimilate its spirit. Then you will always remember and meditate on the Lord, Who will manifest Himself to you."
Dear readers! Hemadpant got Prasad of sugar-candy then; and we now get the Prasad of sugar-candy or nectar of this story. Let us drink it to out heart's content, meditate on it, and assimilate it, and be strong and happy by Baba's grace. Amen!

Rashmi · 10-19-2007, 03:16 AM

Dear friends,
namaste,

The knowledge of Brahma or God is very mystic and an able Guru only can tell you and reveal Him to you.All the ecxerpts i have taken for general guidance of every body in this forum.The sidhha purush like Sai baba of shirdi, swami Nityananda, swami ramkrishna param hansa, lord chaitanaya, Swaminarayan, Pad vallabh, Adi shankara,Buddha, trailanga swami rarely take rebirth , as they have perfected this art of self realisation, if they have come on earth again it is on divines will for the benefit of ignorant masses like you and me.The nectar of their wisdom should be read and read again to understand what they intend to say.all were brahma gyanis and highly evovled souls.But still on taking birth again did tapasya and yoga.Please read this account of sai babas guru from his own mouth as recorded by das ganu and translated in english by hemadpant :

Hemadpant describes the samsara (visible world) by the allegory of Ashvattha (Banyan) tree which has, in the phraseology of the Geeta, roots above and branches below. Its branches are spread downwards and upwards and are nourished by the gunas (qualities), and its sprouts are the objects of the senses. Its roots, leading to actions, are extended downwards to this world of men. Its form cannot be known in this world, nor its end, its beginning nor its support. Cutting this Ashvattha tree of strong roots with the sharp weapon of non-attachment, one should seek the path beyond, treading which there is no return.
For traversing this path, the help of a good guide (Guru) is absolutely necessary. However learned a man may be, or however deep his study of Vedas and Vedangas (sacred literature) may be, he cannot go to his destination safely. If the guide be there to help him and show him the right way, he would avoid the pitfalls and the wild beasts on the journey, and everything will be smooth-sailing.
Baba's experience in this matter, the story which He gave out Himself, is really wonderful, which, when attended to, will give you faith, devotion and salvation.
The Quest
Once four of us were studying religious scriptures and other books and, being thus enlightened, we began to discuss the nature of the Brahman. One of us said that we should raise the self by the Self and not depend on others. To this the second replied that he who controls his mind is blessed; we should be free from thoughts and ideas and there is nothing in the world without us. The third said that the world (phenomenon) is always changing, the formless is eternal; so we should discriminate between the Unreal and the Real. And the fourth (Baba Himself) urged that bookish knowledge is worthless and added, "Let us do our prescribed duty and surrender our body, mind and five pranas (life) to the Guru's feet. Guru is God, all pervading. To get this conviction, strong unbounded faith is necessary."
Discussing in this wise, we four learned men began to ramble through the woods in the quest of God. The three wanted to make the quest with their free and unaided intellect. On the way a Vanjari (a man who trades in certain things, such as grain etc. by carrying them on bullock) met us and asked us, "It is hot now, where and how far are you going?". "To search the woods", we replied. He enquired, "On what quest are you bound?" We gave him an ambiguous and evasive reply. Seeing us rambling aimlessly, he was moved and said, "Without knowing the woods fully, you should not wander at random. If you want to walk through forests and jungles, you should take a guide with you. Why do you exert youselves unnecessarily at this sultry noon-time? You may not give out to me your secret quest; still you can sit down, eat bread, drink water, take rest and then go. Be always patient at heart." Though he spoke so tenderly, we discarded his request and marched on. We thought that we were self-contained men and needed nobody's help. The woods were vast and trackless, the trees therein grew so close and tall, that the sun's rays could not penetrate through them; so we lost our way and wandered here and there for a long time. Ultimately through sheer good luck, we came back to the place from were we started. The Vanjari met us again and said, "Relying on your own cleverness you missed your way; a guide is always necessary to show us the right way in small or great matters; and no quest can be successfully carried out on an empty stomach. Unless God wills it, no one meets us on the way. Do not discard offers of food; served dish should not be thrust away. Offers of bread and food should be regarded as auspicious signs of success." Saying this he again offered us food and asked us to be calm and patient. Again we did not like this good hospitality and discarded his offer and went away. Without doing any quest and without taking any food, the three began to move out. So obstinate were they. I was hungry and thirsty and I was moved with the Vanjari's extraordinary love; we thought ourselves very learned but were quite strangers to pity and kindness. The Vanjari was a quite illiterate and unqualified fellow and belonged to a low caste. Still he had love in his heart and asked us to eat the bread. In this way he who loves others disinterestedly is really enlightened and I thought acceptance of his hospitality was the best beginning of getting knowledge. So very respectfully I accepted the loaf of bread offered, ate it and drank water.
Then to! The Guru at once came and stood before us, "What was the dispute about?" He asked and I told him everything that had happened. Then he said, "Would you like to come with me? I will show you what you want; but he alone, who believes in what I say, will be successful." The others did not agree to what he said and left him; but I bowed to him reverently and accepted his dictum. Then he took me to a well, tied my feet with a rope and hung me - head downwards and feet up - from a tree near the well. I was suspended three feet above the water, which I could not reach with My hands, nor which could go into my mouth. Suspending me in this manner he went away, no one knew where. After 10 or 12 ghatakas (4 or 5 hours) he returned and taking me out quickly asked me how I fared. "In Bliss supreme, I was. How can a fool like me describe the joy I experienced?" I replied. On hearing my answer the Guru was much pleased with me, drew me near him and stroking my body with his hand kept me with him. He took care of me as tenderly as a mother-bird does of her young ones. He put me into his school; how beautiful it was! There I forgot my parents, all my attachment was snapped and I was liberated easily. I thought that I should embrace his neck and remain staring at him always. If his image were not fixed in my pupils, I would like better to be blind. Such was the school! No one, who entered it once, could return empty-handed. My Guru became my all-in-all, my home and property, mother and father, everything. All my senses left their places and concentrated themselves in my eyes, and my sight was centred on him. Thus was my Guru, the sole object of my meditation and I was conscious of none else. While meditating on him my mind and intellect were stunned and I had thus to keep quiet and bow to him in silence.
There are other schools where you see an altogether different spectacle. The disciples go there to seek knowledge and spend their money, time and labour; but ultimately they have to repent. The Guru there boasts of his secret knowledge and his straight-forwardness. He makes a show of his sacredness and holiness, but he is not tender at heart. He speaks a lot and sings his own glory; but his own words do not touch the disciples' hearts and they are not convinced. So far as Self-realization is concerned, he has none. How can such schools be of any use to the disciples and how can they be benefited? The master (Guru) mentioned above was of different type. By his grace, realization flashed upon me of itself, without effort or study. I had not to seek anything, but everything became clear to me as broad day-light. The Guru alone knows how the topsy-turvy Suspension, 'with head down and feet up' can give happiness!

Om

Rashmi · 10-19-2007, 03:25 AM

Among the four, one was a Karmatha (Ritualistic) who only knew how to observe, and abstain from, certain rites; the second was a Jnani, who was puffed up with pride of knowledge and the third was a Bhakta who surrendered himself completely to God, believing that he was the sole Doer. When they were discussing and arguing, the question of God turned up, and they, depending on their unaided knowledge, went in search of Him. Sai, who was Discrimination and Dispassion incarnate, was one of the four. Being Himself Brahman Incarnate, some may ask, "Why did He mix with them and act foolishly?" He did this for attaining the good of the public, and setting them an example to follow. Though an incarnation Himself, He respected a low Vanjari, by accpeting his food with the firm belief that "Food is Brahman" and showed how those who rejected Vanjari's hospitable offer suffered and how it was impossible to get Jnana without a Guru. The Shruti (Taittiriya Upanishad) exhorts us to honour and worship mother, father and preceptor, and to study (learn and teach) the sacred scriptures. These are the means of purifying our minds and unless this purification is effected, self-realization is not possible. Neither the senses, nor the mind and intellect reach the Self. Modes of proof, such as Perception and Inference will not help us in the matter. It is the grace of the Guru that counts. The objects of our life such as Dharma, Artha and Kama are attainable with our effort, but the fourth object, Moksha (liberation) can only he had with the help of the Guru.
In the Darbar of Shri Sai, many personalities appear and play their part; astrologers come and give out their predicitions; princes, noblemen, ordinary and poor men, Sannyasis, Yogis songsters and others come for darshan. Even a mahar comes and, making a Johar (his salutation), says this Sai is the Mai-Baap (True parents), Who will do away with our rounds of births and deaths. So many others such as Jugglers, Gondhalis, the blind and the lame, Nath-panthis, dancers and other players come and are given suitable reception. Biding his own time, the Vanjari also appeared, and played the part assigned to him. Let us now revert to the other story.
All these excerpts related to guru from Swami nityananda and sai baba i have given for all of us to understand the efficacy of Guru and the knowledge of Brahma.
I do request moderator of this site to allow me post these jewels of wisdom which is beneficial for a practioner of yoga to understand what is yoga and how it opens spiritual gateways.The yogic achievement of these Siddha yogis are unimaginable.the tree on which Swami nityananda used to meditate , the leaves of that tree had cured many illness of devotee which were not cured by doctors medicine etc.Blind people have got there eyes and so on. every act of these siddha yogis is worth mentioning .The control over five elements, five perceptions were simply marvellous.By there touch they can transform the people on spiritual path.Both of them were almost at the same time in India, but never used any foul language against each other or have those human feelings of jealousy.Sai baba had helped gajanan mahahraj, upasani baba and other people.Gajanan maharaj himself was an advanced soul.

I hope the underlying meaning of these words by baba and his life is beneficial to you all

OM

Rashmi · 10-25-2007, 03:26 AM

Dear friends,
namaste,
salutions to God, Guru and all realised souls,
We all(soul) take birth as per deeds.Who do not believe in rebirth i would like to tell.We all are aware of the history of the world after mahabharat war which is accepted by historians, Conquest of christanity, Islam, Persecution of Jews, Hindus, and native tribes on the name of religion, world has fought two world wars. If you consider these deaths and there is only one birth so then the population of the world should be decreasing but here the case is opposite.We are ever increasing.Every day there is a death and birth somewhere in world.A soul leaves the body and after 13 days enters and takes the birth as per its deeds.Listen to all the great siddhas like sai baba, swami Nityananda, swami narayan, Swami sammarth, Swami gajanan maharaj , Rammanna Maharishi etc. by the siddhi of knowing past present and future they have told many times their devottes and bhakta why are they sufferring, why they have bad husbands etc. In this regards vedas states like this:
Idea of Yajurveda mantra 39/6 is that after leaving the human body, the soul goes to several matters in the space etc., and then according to good or bad deeds takes next birth. Yajurved mantra 39/7 states that those souls who do sins they take birth with violent nature like wolves, bear and those who give fear to others in human body, they take birth in body with dangerous nature like crocodiles, poisonous snakes, tigers, lions, wild boars etc., those who give fear to others, they will be of timid nature like rabbits,deer etc. Those who give justice and make others fearless, they will take next birth in a fearless nature. Those who are indulged in illusion, they will take birth in a place where the atmosphere will be full of illusion(Yajurveda mantra 40/3 also refers). Those who are learned Yogis but are not yet attained salvation, they will take next birth in a place where there will not be any illusion but divine enlightenment. Those who have not controlled their five senses, five perceptions and mind then in the next birth they will be of restless nature. But those who have controlled their senses etc., will be of calm, peaceful nature. Those who have followed eternal knowledge, they will also be of peaceful nature in the next birth.
Atharvaveda mantra 9/10/16 states that those who are not learned in this birth, they will get the birth as "sthavar" rooted plants etc., as birds and as animals etc., and those who are learned they take next birth as rishi-munis. So the soul based on his sins or pious deeds takes birth in upper class or lower class. The above said Atharvaveda mantra also states that the soul in the human body knows each and everything that is each outer matter of the world but due to involvement in illusion, soul does not know himself.
As Manusmriti states in shlok 1/43-46 the soul according to deeds takes birth as animal, non-violent deer etc., carnivores like tiger, leopards etc., devils, human beings. Ths said are of "jarayuj" type i.e., those who take birth from their skin i.e., tissue. Soul takes birth as "undaj" type i.e., those who hatch from eggs like birds, snakes, crocodiles, fish, tortoise, etc. Soul takes birth in "Swedaj" type i.e., those who take birth from sweat, humidity, moisture, for-example, lice, mosquitoes, flies,
bed-bugs etc.
Soul also takes birth in Udbhij i.e., who takes birth from within the earth like plants who emerge from seeds etc., and are stable at one place like trees etc. So there are four above quoted main origin(yonis) of which the total number comes as 84
lakhs.

i have asked this question about yonis with support of vedas.i wanted to share this knowledge with you all.dear friends thats why we should shower our love to all animals , plants and look after them.In my next post i will quote examples from life of siddha purush to highlight this point.

OM

Rashmi · 10-26-2007, 03:40 AM

Dear friends,
namaste,

The fruits of karma or action is strange. We normal people get swayed by temptations, lust, anger and intellect. When we do yoga by steady practice slowly - 2 your veil is lifted.Now as a soul i am quite concious of my karma and action i do not want to hurt others, or be aparty of any thing bad.Further after reading biographies of many brahma gyanis i have learned that the ultimate aim of life is god realisation.Veda and yoga i have zeroed on after reading and contemplation and my own search. I pray to God please let me the know the truth however bitter it is so that i can correct myself in this birth.Lord rama, krishna, sai baba, Nityananda and other yogis. Thats why i say do yoga and yajna it will help you as a soul in destroying your bad or evil karmas.Now one incident as told by brahma gyani sai baba of shirdi on how we pay for our karmas:

Blessed is the face of Sai. If we cast a glance at Him for a moment, He destroys the sorrow of many past births and confers great bliss on us; and if He looks at us with grace, our bondage of Karma is immediately snapped away and we are led to happiness. The river Ganges washes away the dirt and sins of all people who go to her for a bath; but she intently longs for the saints to come to her and bless her with their feet and remove all the dirt (sins) accumulated in her. She knows for certain that this accumulation can only be removed by the holy feet of the saints. Sai is the crest-jewel of the saints, and now hear from Him the following purifying story.
The Snake and the Frog
Sai Baba said - "One morning after taking My breakfast I strolled along till I came to a small river bank. As I was tired, I rested there, washed My hands and feet and had a bath and felt refreshed. There was a foot-path and a cart-track sheltered by shady trees. The breeze was also blowing gently. As I was preparing to smoke chillim (pipe), I heard the croaking of a frog. I was striking the flint and lighting the fire, when a traveller turned up, sat by My side, bowed to Me and politely invited Me to his house for meals and rest. He lit up the pipe and handed it over to Me. The croaking was heard again and he wanted to know what it was. I told him that a frog was in trouble and was tasting the bitter fruit of its own karma. We have to reap now the fruit of what we sow (do) in our past life, and there is no use in crying about it. Then he smoked and handed over the pipe to Me and said that he would go there in person and see for himself. I told him that a frog was caught by a big snake and was crying. Both were very wicked in their past life and were now reaping the fruit of their actions in these bodies. He went out and found that a huge black serpent was holding a big frog in its mouth.
He turned to Me and said that in about 10 or 12 minutes the frog would be eaten up by the snake. I said, "No, this can't be. I am its father (protector) and I am here now. How shall I allow the snake to eat it up, am I here for nothing? Just see how I release it."
After smoking again, we walked on to the place. He was afraid and asked Me not to proceed further as the snake might attack us. Not minding him, I went ahead and addressed the creatures thus:- "Oh Veerbhadrappa, has not your enemy Bassappa yet repented though he has been born as a frog, and you too, though born as a serpent, still maintain bitter enmity against him? Fie upon you, be ashamed, give up your hatred now and rest in peace."
Hearing these words, the snake left the frog quickly and dived into the river and disappeared. The frog also jumped away and hid itself in the bushes.
The traveller was much surprised; he said that he could not understand how the snake dropped the frog and disappeared at the words uttered, who was Veerbhadrappa and who was Basssappa, and what was the cause of their enmity. I returned with him to the foot of the tree and after sharing a few puffs of smoke with him I explained the whole mystery to his as follows:-
There was ancient holy place sanctified by a temple of Mahadev about 4 or 5 miles from My place. The temple was old and dilapidated. The residents of the place collected funds for its repairs. After a large amount was collected, arrangement for worship was made and plans with estimates for repairs were prepared. A rich local man was appointed the Treasurer and the whole work was entrusted to him. He was to keep regular accounts and be honest in all his dealings. He was a first class miser and spent very little for the repairs, which consequently made very little progress. He spent all the funds, swallowed some amount himself and spent nothing from his pocket. He had a sweet tongue and was very clever in offering plausible explanations regarding the poor and tardy progress of the work. The people again went to him and said that unless he lent his helping hand and tried his best, the work would not be complete. They requested him to work out the scheme and again collected subscriptions and sent the amount to him. He received it, but sat as quiet as before without making any progress. After some days, God (Mahadev) appeared in his wife's dream and said to her - "You get up, build the dome of the temple, I will give you a hundred-fold of what you spend." She told this vision to her husband. He was afraid that it would involve him in some expenses and therefore laughed it out saying that it was a mere dream, a thing not to be relied and acted upon, or else why did not God appear to him and tell him? Was he far off from her? This looks like a bad dream, having for its object the creation of ill feeling between husband and wife. She had to remain quiet.
God does not like big subscriptions and donations collected against the wishes of the donors, but He likes ever trifling amounts given with love, devotion and appreciation. Some days after, God again appeared in her dream and said - "Do not bother yourself about your husband and the collections with him. Don't press him to spend any amount for the temple. What I want is, feeling and devotion. So give, if you like, anything of your own." She consulted her husband about this vision and decided to give God her ornaments given by her father. The miser felt disconcerted and decided to cheat even God in this item. He undervalued the ornaments at Rs.1,000/- and bought them himself and in lieu of the amount gave a field to God as endowment or security. The wife agreed to this. The field or land was not his own, it belonged to one poor woman named Dubaki who mortgaged it to him for Rs.200/-. She was not able to redeem it for long. So the cunning miser cheated all, his wife, Dubaki and even God. The land was sterile, uncultivated and worth nothing and yielded nothing, even in best seasons.
the rest post i am pasting in next thread

Rashmi · 10-26-2007, 03:41 AM

Thus ended this transaction and the land was given in the possession of the poor priest who was pleased with the endowment. Sometime later on, strange things happened. There was a terrific storm and heavy down-pour of rain; lightning struck the house of the miser, when he and his wife both died. Dubaki also breathed her last.
In the next life, the rich miser was born at Mathura in a Brahmin family and was named Veerbhadrappa. His devout wife was born as the daughter of the priest of the temple and was named Gouri. The woman Dubaki (the mortgagor) was born as a male in the family of the Gurav (attendent) of the the temple and was named Chenbassappa. The priest was a friend of Mine, He often came to Me, chatted and smoked with Me. His daughter Gouri was also devoted to Me. She was growing fast and her father was seeking a good husband for her. I told him not to worry about this as the bridegroom himself would come seeking her. Then there came a poor boy named Veerbhadrappa of their caste, wandering and begging his bread to the priest's house. With My consent Gouri was given in marriage to him. He was also at first devoted to Me as I recommended his marriage with Gouri. Even in this new life he was hankering after money and asked Me to help him to get it as he was leading a married man's life.
Strange things happened. There was a sudden rise in prices. By Gouri's good luck, there was a great demand for land and the endowment land was sold for one lakh of rupees (100 times the worth of her ornaments). Half the amount was paid in cash and the remaining was to be paid in 25 instalments of Rs. 2,000/- each. All agreed to this transaction, but began to quarrel over the money. They came to Me for consultation. I told them that the property belonged to God and was vested in the priest and Gouri was his sole heiress and proprietress and no amount should be spent without her consent and that her husband had no right whatsoever to the amount. Hearing my opinion Veerbhadrappa was wroth with Me and said that I wanted to establish Gouri's claim and embezzle her property. Hearing his words, I remembered God and kept quiet. Veerbhadrappa scolded his wife (Gouri) and she came to Me at noon and requested Me not to mind the words of others and not to discard her as she was My daughter. As she thus sought My protection I gave her a pledge that I would cross seven seas to help her. Then that night Gouri had a vision. Mahadev appeared in her dream and said - "The whole money is yours, do not give anything to anybody, spend some amount for temple purposes in consultation with Chenbassappa and if you want to use it for some other purpose, consult Baba in the Masjid (Myself)." Gouri told Me the vision and I gave her the proper advice in the matter. I told her to take the principal or capital amount to herself, give half the amount of interest to Chenbassappa and that Veerbhadrappa had nothing to do in the matter. While I was thus talking, both Veerbhadrappa and Chenbassappa came there quarreling. I tried My best to appease them and told them God's vision to Gouri. Veerbhadrappa got wild and angry and threatened to kill Chenbassappa cutting him to pieces. The latter was timid, he caught my feet and sought my refuge. I pledged Myself to save him from the wrath of his foe. Then after some time Veerbhadrappa died and was born as a snake and Chenbassappa died and was born as a frog. Hearing the croaking of Chenbassappa and remembering my pledge, I came here, saved him and kept My word. God runs to His devotees for help in times of danger. He saved Chenbassappa (the frog) by sending Me here. All this is God's Leela or sport."
The Moral
The moral of the story is that one has to reap what one sows, and there is no escape unless one suffers and squares up one's old debts and dealings with others, and that greed for money drags the greedy man to the lowest level and ultimately brings destruction on him and others.

i hope you have understood my previous post with support from vedas on rebirth and karma.
OM

Rashmi · 10-28-2007, 01:22 AM

Dear friend,

Namaste,
Few mantras from vedas with meanings for you all, with the practice of yoga , kill your sorrows, read these mantras and understand God and vedas. If possible do yajen. Something which is not possible in physical world is possible in spiritual world. By the grace and permission of Guru and God i am putting for you all.

Rigveda mantra 2/12/2

YAHA PRITHIVEEM VYATHAMAANAAMADRINGHADYAHA PARVATAANPRKUPITAAM ARAMNNAAT.
YO ANTRIKSHAMA VIMAME VAREEYO YO DYAAMASTABHNAATSA JANAS INDRAHA.

O! (JANASAHA) learned man (YAHA) he who (VYATHAMAANAAM) rotating (PRITHIVEEM) earth (ADRINGHAT) holds (YAHA) who (PRAKUPITAAN) like angry enemies (PARVATAAN) to clouds (ARAMNNAT) disperses (YAHA) who (VAREEYAHA) huge extensive ( ANTARIKSHAM) space (VIMAME) gives respect i.e., holds and (YAHA) who (DYAM) light (ASTBHNAAT) holds (SAHA) the God (INDRAHA) Himself is Almighty God who too disperses the matters like sun. So amongst the unlimited names of God based on His divine qualities, His one name is also Sun. he is the only God who is to be known.

Idea:
O! learned man he who holds the rotating earth, who disperses the clouds like angry enemies, who gives respect i.e., holds the huge, extensive space, who holds light i.e., who is form of light and gives light to other heavenly bodies, He is only God who is to be known.

Atharavaveda 12/1/11

GIRYASTE PARVATA HIMVANTORANNYAM TE PRITHVI SYONAMASTU. <br BABHRUM KRISHNNAM ROHINNEEM VISWAROOPAAM DHRUVAAM BHOOMIM PRITHIVEEMINDRAGUPTAAM.
AJEETOHATO AKSHATODHYASHTHAAM PRITHIVEEMAHAM.

(PRITHVI) O! earth (TE) your (GIRYAHA) hills and (HIMVANTAHA) ice laiden peaks (PARVATAAHA) mountains and (TE) yours (ARANNYAM) forests (SEYONAM) delightful to heart (ASTU) may.

Idea: O! earth may your mountains, ice-laiden peaks and your forests be delightful to out heart.

(BABHRUM) nursing (KRISHNNAAM) ploughing (ROHINNEEM) fertile (VISHWARUPAAM) of several beautiful shapes (DHRUVAAM) of de-shaped nature (BHOOMIM) place of shelter (PRITHVEEM) extensive (INDRAGUPTAAM) protected by warriors (PRITHVEEM) of earth (AJEETAHA) without being destroyed and (AHATAHA) without being killed (AKASHATAHA) without being wounded (AHAM) may I (ADHI ASTHAM) be establisher/caretaker.

Idea:
O! God without being destroyed, killed or wounded may I be establisher/caretaker of the earth which nurses, is plough-able, fertile, of several beautiful shapes, which is of de-shaped nature, is a place of shelter, extensive, protected by warriors.

Atharavaveda 12/1/17

VISHWASVAM MAATARAMOSHDHEENAAM DHRUVAAM BHUMIM PRITHIVEEM DHARMANNA DHRITAAM.
SHIVAAM SYONAMANU CHAREM VISHWAHA.

(VISHWASVAM) PRODUCER OF ALL (AUSHADHEENAAM) crops, vegetation, medicinal plants (MATRAM) mother land (DHRUVAAM) firm (BHOOMIM) place of shelter (DHARMANNA) which by its nature of holding and deeds (DHRITAAM) has been held. (SHIVAAM) it is beneficial (SEYONAAM) delightful to heart (PRITHIVEEM ANU) behind the earth (VISHWAHA) in various kinds (CHAREM) to follow.

Idea:
O! God may we follow in various kinds, the earth which is the beneficial and delightful to heart. The earth is our mother. It is of firm nature, is beneficial, delightful to heart, shelter giving, producer of all crops, vegetation, medicinal plants and exhibits its nature of holding all matters and creates deeds.

Yajurveda mantra 32/4

YEN DYOORUGRA PRITHVI CHA DRIDHA YEN SWA STBHITAM YEN NAKHA YO ANTARIKSHE RAJSO VIMANAHA KASMI DEVAI HAVISHA VIDHEMA.

(YEN) the God by whom (UGRA) strong light emitting (DYOHO) heavenly bodies (CHA) and ( PRITHVI) earth and space (DRIDHA) established firmly.

Meaning: The God by whom the strong light emitting heavenly bodies and earth and space etc., have been firmly established.

(YEN) and the God by whom (SWAHA) un-finishing merriment (STABHITAM) is held and (YEN)the God by whom (NAKAHA)salvation is held and (YAHA) the God (ANTARIKSHE) in the space (RAJSAHA) universe/world (VIMANAHA) specially creates (KASMAI) i.e., shape of merriment too.

KASMAI word is made of 'KUM' dhatu of Sanskrit which gives the meaning of merriment. (DEVAAYA) for the dev i.e., God. (HAVISHA) by offerings i.e., aahuti, Yaj /yoga-abhyaas i.e., preach of ashtang yoga. It should be noted that worship of God. If we offer aahuti on havan kund in burning fire, do Yaj and ashtang yoga practice (VIDHEMA) VI=special, DHEM=worship. In this way we do the best worship.

Idea: The worship is of no use if we do not know the real qualities of God. The God has unlimited unchangeable and immortal qualities, which have been mentioned in the Vedas by God Himself. In this mantra some of the qualities are seen. The idea of mantra is that who is God to worship? Mantra says the light emitting heavenly bodies like sun, moon, stars etc., gives us invaluable light etc., and the earth/space where we reside all the said universe is held and created by God only. He is the shape of merriment and the worshiper is provided with the merriment. Salvation is also held by God and God is only powered to bless to real worshipper with the salvation where every sorrows etc., are ended. There is no other God and will never be in future who can do this task. So we have to worship only the God who is one and will remain unchanged, who creates the universe etc., is formless and immortal.

May we all become like Lord Krishna, rama, Bhisma and all vedanisht people who have attained God and eternal merriment

Rashmi · 10-31-2007, 05:03 AM

Dear friends,
namaste,
Every time i tell you about vedas and its greatness as i have read and understood. I will tell about this sacred vedas as told by brahma gyani.There is one more brahma gyani who is contemporary of shirdi sai baba, he is Gajanan maharaj of Shegaon.Both of them were brahma leen purush. you and me are mere mortals who perceive everything by senses, intellect and mind. Where as a brahmaleen purush sees God in every being.He has crossed that stage and become one with God. So we should listen to such brahma gyanis what he says of vedas:

While Maharaj lived at the house of Khandu Patil, there came some Telangi Brahmins. These Telangi Brahmins are known to be quite orthodox, learned and in charge of the authority of Vedic knowledge, but their biggest drawback is that they are somewhat greedy for money. They came to Shri Maharaj with the hope of getting some money from Him. When they came, Shri Maharaj was sleeping. The Brahmins started reciting Vedic hymns loudly to awaken Shri Maharaj. There was some mistake in their recitation, but they did not correct it, so Shri Maharaj got up and said to them, "Why have you become Vedic? You are lowering the greatness of Vedas unnecessarily. This knowledge is not for the purpose of running a business but for the salvation 0f human beings. At least show some respect to the saffron head-dress, which indicates that you are a Vedic. I will now recite the hymns and you repeat the same as I pronounce. Do not misguide innocent poor believers." Saying so Shri Maharaj recited the same chapter of Vedas, this was being recited by these Brahmins incorrectly. His pronunciation was clear, loud and there was not a single mistake in His recitation. It appeared as if Vashistha himself was reciting the holy Vedas. The Brahmins were astonished and felt embarrassed to even lift their faces. The analogy can be compared to a lit candle fantasizing that it has better capacity to spread light around itself than the sun itself. The Brahmins first thought that Shri Maharaj was a mad person, but now found Him to be a learned saint. They were convinced that all the four Vedas were on the tip of His tongue. They took Shri Maharaja to be a God incarnate and a Brahmin by caste - a yogi free of any bondage or attachment, and because of their good deeds of previous life, they believed they were fortunate enough to get the "Darshan" of such a Godly saint. Shri Maharaja asked Khandu Patil to give them a rupee each as "Dakshina". The Brahmins accepted this dakshina and happily went away.

Like sai baba of shirdi, his birth details and other things are shrouded in mystery. Just one fine day he was seen in shegaon and was sighted by two people who thought him earlier to be a mad man but later on realised him to be a great saint. It is belived among the masses in india that the great swami samarth of akkalkot was the Guru of sai baba and gajanan maharaj. Swami sammarth was lord datttreya. please do read about him, a real brahma purush like him, sai baba, nityananda, gajanan maharaj, ramkrishna paramhansa, rammana rishi has made India a Tirth.Since time immerorial many yogis have done penance and tapasya in this pious land to realise the higher truths in life by Vedas and yoga.

Further we had a discussion on Bhakti yoga, Karma and Gyan Yoga.Please listen what this brahma gyani has said and try to understand it:

Once, Shri Maharaj went to Akot to meet his saint brother Narsinghji, who was a disciple of Kotasha. Although Maratha by caste, he had become dear to Shri Vithala by his Bhakti (devotion). Since I have narrated his detail life in “Bhaktileelamrut", I don't repeat in here. Akot is 36 miles to the north-east of Shegaon and Gajanan Maharaj went there with the speed of wind. Shri Narsinghji was staying in the dense forest near Akot to get solitude. This forest, without any habitants, was very dense with big trees, creepers, wild grass and many snakes in it. In such dreadful forest Shri Narsinghji was living all alone. Shri Gajanan went there to meet him. Water mixes with water and like things merge with each other. Unlike things never mix with each other. So looking at Shri Gajanan, Shri Narsinghji was happy beyond description. One was Hari and the other Har, one was Rama, while other, the son of Vasudeo-Devaki. One was Ganga and the other that of Godavari. One was the Kohinoor, and the other Kaustubha. One was the Vashistha and the other, son of Anjani. Both of them met each other and were very happy. They sat near each other and exchanged their experiences.
Shri Gajanan said, "Narsinha, you have done well by leading a family life. I renounced that and followed the path of Yoga, to know the ultimate reality, the "Brahma". In this path of yoga, many strange things, incomprehensible to the common man, happen, and to hide them I, many times, behave like a mad man. To know the ultimate Truth there are three paths - Karma, Bhakti and Yoga. Apparently they look like three different paths, but in reality they reach the same goal. If a yogi feels proud of his path, he will remain away from the ultimate Truth. He should keep himself clean from the effect of Yogakriya, like a lotus leaf. Then only he can know the ultimate Truth. Same is the case with family life. You should not have attachment with your family. A pebble remains in water, but does not allow the water to enter it. Such should be your behaviour in family life - free from any expectations and with full concentration in Almighty. Then nothing is impossible. You, me and God are one, and the people too are not different from Him."
Shri Narsinghji said, "I am grateful to you for meeting me. This "Prapanch" is unreal like the shadow at noon. I will follow your advice, but keep on coming to me. Everything is predestined in this world, and we have to perform our duty in this life as per desire of God. My only, request is that you should come frequently to meet me as I am your younger brother. Just like Bharat, waiting at Nandigram for Shri Ram, I am here at Akot for you. With your yogic achievements, it is very easy for you to come here. A yogi, without touching anywhere, can traverse around the universe in minutes."
With intimate love for each other, they were speaking all that night. Real saints behave like this only, but the hypocrites quarrel with each other. These hypocrites should not be accepted as Guru as they are like a broken ship on the sea. They receive a lot of publicity, but carefully we should discard them. Living in a "math" or learning an art of composing poems does not make one a saint, but only self knowledge does it. Can we accept gold-coated articles as gold, or a prostitute as a house wife? These two saints were real and pious. When people knew that Shri Gajanan Maharaj had come to meet Shri Narsinghji, They thought it to be the confluence of Godavari and Bhagirathi and by going there they could get the satisfaction of taking a dip in that confluence. So the people with coconuts in their hands started rushing to the forest. But Shri Gajanan, with the permission of Shri Narsinghji had already left and all the people were disappointed.

I hope this must have enlightened us.
Om

Rashmi · 11-02-2007, 11:07 PM

Dear friends,
namaste,
In india this is the time of festivals.Wish you all a very happy diwali, though you all do not celebrate it.This festival is celebrated in the rememberence of Lord Rama who returned to ayodhya after a exile of 14 years with his wife.I am going on a vacation and you will not be hearing me for a month.

may god bless all

om

spiridoul · 11-03-2007, 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hubert

What I learnt form Rudolf Steiner:
The Vedas, -written in a time when people had vital bodies excessing their physical bodies, and such, they still had a connection through it to the spiritual world - represent spiritual realities not for just understanding but as they are result of actual experincing, and not revelations to profhets and recorded by other people, as the Bible as example, they are divine also in their form. That does not mean one cannot use reason to study them, but they are more than a text to understood.

I am glad that through your explanations I've become a bit more familiar how the Vedas are, Rashmi.

(Comparison is used as it is, without any judgement of value. Of course both these holy sources have good reasons to be as they are.)

hi, do you recall by any chance, which book of Steiner's it is?
thank you

Hubert · 12-10-2007, 04:04 PM

Sorry, I just noticed your question.

It is in "The East in the Light of the West" ... it also has a subtitle, The children of Lucifer and the brothers of Christ. Boohoo !!!

Hubert · 12-10-2007, 04:38 PM

To Rashmi ...
I learnt gayatri mantra and did use it with success. It has a great power. I have grown great respect for it as I found that there can be a link made with my religion. First, the word "savitur" catched my attention. It reminded me of the word "saviour". Don't ask me why ... it just popped in. But it did not let me rest and found about Savitr on wiki:

"In Vedic religion, Savitr (stem), Savitā (nominativesingular) is a solar deity (see Deva) and one of the Adityas. His name is in Vedic Sanskrit meanings "impeller, rouser, vivifier".
Savitr is described in the Vedas as having golden arms, hands, hair, etc. He is sometimes identified with, and at other times distinguished from, the chief Sun deity Surya. A number of beautiful Vedic hymns are invoked in his praise. He is the god of the Sun at Sunrise andSunset, and was most often invoked in the latter role in Vedic hymns."

Steiner tought that the Christ has come through a Sun being. The transfiguration scene from the gospels of the New Testament on mount Hermon describes the saviour with His face glowing like the Sun. Steiner said that Zarathustra (Zoroaster) an initiate ruler of the proto-persians (preshistoric cultural age in the persian geographic area) saw the descending Christ in the Sun's aura.

Too much coincidence to neglect, I am not jumping to any conclusions but I think this entitles me to make this intuitive connection anytime I chant this mantra. This also worths investigation, for the greater good of understanding each other's religion and marvel of the hidden, common truths.
I believe with fervor that all great religions represent the same facets of an universal truth, and this being so without to take away anything from any of them. Christianity in it's outer expression cannot match the insight and revelation of the Vedas, but an esoteric christianity could use the depths of India's inner knowledge just as India uses the outer achievments of western culture.

Please share if you know more of Savitr.

spiridoul · 12-10-2007, 05:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hubert

Sorry, I just noticed your question.

It is in "The East in the Light of the West" ... it also has a subtitle, The children of Lucifer and the brothers of Christ. Boohoo !!!

interesting; worth a read?

Rashmi · 12-10-2007, 11:19 PM

Dear friends,
namaste,
I have been on a long vacation to a place called amaipakkam in chennai near mahabalipuram.Have seen 1400 years old temple at tripurkundalam where the great siddha yogi Lord shiva and siddha yogin parvati his consort is worshipped which has its own legend.But the temple was magnificent and the experience too visit was truly divine.Lord Shiva, was a great siddha yogi same is his consort parvati/sati etc. He was there prior to birth of Lord Rama. He is always shown engrossed in state of samadhi enjoying somaras.Soma ras or soma in vedas is described as a divine merriment/bliss which a yogi enjoys when he is in a state of samadhi.People think it is alcohol this is not correct.Shiva is always in a state of samadhi. The third eye represented is a spiritual eye which is awakened in him by the divine powers and hard practice of astanga yoga.Incidentally all 12 Jyotirlinga in india are associated with this great siddha yogi.Swami Nityananda is believed to be the same soul.Till the time he was alive there was a pertpetual water which was flowing on a ancient shiva linga at a shiva temple at Ganeshpuri.Once a devotee came for his darshan at Ashram at Ganeshpuri. He could not find him there, he got dejected and was going back, on his return journey he went to this shiva temple, he saw nityananda there with his one leg on Shivlinga and having trishul.As per vedas That formless omniscient ever present God has no husband, wife, he never takes birth or dies.With his will and dream during the day of brahma the world is running.The law of karma is the basis of all beings.However the highly realised souls on divines will take birth to guide us and show the correct path whenever dharma is on decline.This is referred as incarnation.
Essentially what i have understood is mainly all the traditions of India have roots in vedas.However post mahabharat war due to decline of knowledge of vedas and sorrows people had forgotten the root(vedas) and it became traditions.Lets have a look at all these:

1. Respect of parents : As per vedas there are five alive Gods and 33 non alive Gods. Parents are among two alive Gods (Mother and father). All siddha yogis have emphasised on respecting parents and treating them at par with God.

2. Guru shishya parampara. This itself have its root in vedas. The first Guru of Four rishis at the bigning of creation was almighty God. Then this tradition continued.Further all the arts like classical music, dance, Brahma Gyan have Guru shishya parampara.The highest Knowledge in the world is Brahma Gyan can only be imparted by a worthy Guru. On this i have dealt at length.

3. Marraiage: The indian marriage has vedic roots.First Garlands are exchanged between bride and groom.A pious fire is lighted as per vedas,The hymns from vedas along with ahutis are chanted and sapta padi or seven vows are being taken by bride and Groom.The marraigae is conducted by a person who knows vedas and its procedures.Vedas doesnot talk of Dowry or other things.As per vedas the age of marriage for Girl is 18 and boys 21.Bal vivah all have come post islamic invasion and superstitions.As under the islamic rule girls were abducted and raped and it was justified under islams tenets. so to avoid all this bal vivah, parda pratha have come got included.The custom of arranged marriage is as per vedas.there are sixteen typers of marriage as per vedas.

4. Women. In vedas it is told to respect women. It is said where women are given and treated with respect there resides God and that house will be full of wealth and happiness.Women have equal right as men in vedas they were brahma gyanis, learned of vedas.Even during Shankrachayas time in 5th century a learned lady had a debate with him.This clearly reflects the position of women prior to invasions.Devi sita, Draupadi all were taught vedas and were highly learned as described in ramayana and mahabharat.They were bachelors like men too.For example Gargi who was Guru of Sita was not married.Shabri who was a shudra as per her profession has patanga muni as her Guru.Her conduct and knowledge is evident in Ramayana.

5. Chastity and Brahmacharya. Women are always advised to be chaste and pativrata. In vedas God has said he has to obey the words of a chaste and pativatra wife. sati Anusuya, savitri and Sita are known as pativrta and chastye wife.Who have always obeyed there husband.Sati anusuya with her chastity has turned siddha yogis like brahma, vishnu and mahesh into kids.Men are advised to follow brahmacharya. AS a married persons men and women are too advised to follow brahmacharya.The aim of marriage is not sex, it is togetherness and spiritual emancipation of soul along with other roles.

God in vedas has said he will always full fill words of a brahma Yogi/saint and a chaste/pativrata wife.When we read all these ancient Granths written by rishis you come to know Animals and man were at peace.Animals would follow instructions of rishis, even ferocious animals were living in peace with each other.This i will explain afterwards with examples from brahmagyanis life.

thats it
Om

Pandara · 12-10-2007, 11:29 PM

Hi Rashmi,

You talk of the five alive Gods and name two of them (mother and father), who are the other three?

spiridoul · 12-10-2007, 11:31 PM

welcome back

it sounds very interesting.

Hubert · 12-11-2007, 01:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spiridoul

interesting; worth a read?

Steiner has a huge opus. I'd recommend "The philosophy of freedom". This is purely philosophic, no metaphysics in it. It is said to be the foundation for understanding of his more occult works. But Steiner is very hard to read. One must have the resilience of a bulldog, as he has his own way of thinking, and most of the things or concepts he uses must be well understood to avoid confusion. I have to say, I did not manage to read "The philospohy of freedom", yet, though I started it quite a few times.

What I read from him is "The occult science"; "Reincarnation and karma"; "The Revelations of John".
He also has a very good book called "Knowledge of higher worlds", very good and fresh view on personal efforts to be done to achieve spiritual sight.

About the title I quoted from, it is a list of conferences held by Steiner, and it brings light on so many things ... But as all of his work, can be misunderstood if we do not understand correctly what he means by the words and concepts he uses. Through his epic work, an unknown grandiouse history of humanity reveals itself, what integrates all religions and traditions, and makes them to be seen in a new, refreshing, elevating way, something to anyone can relate. Traditions come alive in his view, and get in the reach of our everyday life.

Some of his work uses late XIX century scientific beleives and views, now obsolate, what might discard his entire work in the eyes of critics and scpetics. This is a big mistake. He was well aware of the limits of his own age, and he once said that in a thousand years only "The Philospohy of Freedom" will be remembered. This does not make his works irrelevant though. His work is transformative in the deepest sense.

See if you can eat it, if it nis nourishment to you ... if not, than neglect it. I just wanted to warn you, it is not just a read, his works are not intellectual treatises with a blurry subject, as he was a seer, one having direct spiritual sight. They called these prophets, way back.

Sorry Rashmi for highjacking the post, but I did not want to create a new thread on this as I feel it might be outside the scope of this forum. As the quoted title touches hinduism and Vedas, I thought it might be interesting to mention. Now I am done, and will read on what you have to say.

Hubert · 12-11-2007, 01:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rashmi

Dear friends,

5. Chastity and Brahmacharya. Women are always advised to be chaste and pativrata. In vedas God has said he has to obey the words of a chaste and pativatra wife. sati Anusuya, savitri and Sita are known as pativrta and chastye wife.Who have always obeyed there husband.Sati anusuya with her chastity has turned siddha yogis like brahma, vishnu and mahesh into kids.Men are advised to follow brahmacharya. AS a married persons men and women are too advised to follow brahmacharya.The aim of marriage is not sex, it is togetherness and spiritual emancipation of soul along with other roles.

Om

Thank you for sharing this. As it happens, these days I have been reading Saint Augustine on this subject of chastity. The same thing you say it is required also for christians. Apparently the so called sexual revolution did quite a damage to these values.

Rashmi · 12-13-2007, 12:55 AM

Dear frinds,
namaste,

The five alive Gods as per vedas are:
1. Almighty God 2. Mother 3. father 4. Guru 5. Athithi
Only these gods are to be worshipped.Further Savitur has come from savitaha .In gayatri mantra it has been referred to that formless, omniscient God who is creator .God has many names in vedas .At times he is referred as Vishnu, Brahma, Shiva, Vasudev etc.There is only one God rest all gods referred are highly emancipated and realised souls with different forms.
However prior to mahabharat world was following vedic culture.People were keeping beautiful names from vedas.And many souls have realsied God on this Path. Jesus himself was a realised soul from Birth.After liberation/moksha and self realisation soul is free from the debt of karmas.Whenever such soul assumes bodies it remebers everything depending on the stages of realisation.As the kowledge of vedas after realistion is immortal.This is clear from lives of Lord Krishna, Swami Nityananda, sai baba of shirdi, Swami samarth and shri Guru(narsinghmendra saraswati) and jesus too.Such Soul can take birth anywhere as per divine will and purpose

Please do read biographies of this highly realised siddha yogis who have assumed bodies in recent 600 years, you will understand better what i say.Further your senses will get purify and you will get insight as per your devotion, may get spiritual experience too :
1. Swami Nityananda
2 Swami ramakrishna Paramhansa
3.Swami sammarth of akkalkot/shriguru/padvallabh, www.swamisamarth.org
4.Sai baba of shirdi.
5.Shri Gajanan maharaj
6.Swaminarayan
7. Lord chaitanaya.
8.Trailangswami, there is no biography of him but i have read only a small account of his life
further you read autobiography of yogi.you will understand much better
After reading these siddha yogis you will understand Lord Krishna/rama/sage vasistha etc.
As per my Guru:

The target of a human life to realize truth under the guidance of a Guru even continues (in) the family life like Shri Ram, sita etc., or a brahamcharya life like Bal brahmcharini Gargi who was the Guru of king Janak. But now a days due to attraction in materialistic articles only the people have become ignorant about the path of eternal spiritualism for which we have been blessed with a human body.
God is not seen with eyes etc., but God is only realized by a Rishi who knows Vedas philosophy and has practiced ashtang yoga philosophy. Geeta shlok 7/19 also refers. The Rishis have explained their experiences of realizing God and other benefits in their shastras/upnishads etc. And they have clarified in their holy books that they got the knowledge from Vedas traditionally in Guru shishya method. So now a days there may also be the Rishi of such kind. Now there is lack of study of Vedas, therefore people are totally unable to justify that who is the real Guru.
Saamveda mantra 164 wherein it is said," AA TU AA IT" i.e., come, come and come here "NISHIDAT" i.e., sit down please and "INDRAM PRAGYAT" i.e., recite and learn and even sing the reality of Almighty God. Saam veda mantra 252 says YATHA TRISHYAN GAURAH just like a thirsty animal like deer etc., "APA KRITAM IRRINM ETI" goes to a water tank in a jungle. Similarly NA APITEVE KANVESHU we must be desirous of getting contact with learned Guru TUYAM AW AA GAHI SACHA PIB to realize immortal God. So now a days to be thirsty one to realize God or to do pious deeds or to worship or to contact with spiritual master has been a tough taskdue to attraction towards materialistic articles. But Vedas says about the truth that the first birth of a man or woman is from parents which is like darkness, selfishness, being full of illusion. So there is a word in Vedas Dwij, Dwi= second, ja means janam i.e.,birth. So in human life one has to take second birth. This birth is taken from a spiritual master, real Guru who knows eternal philosophy of Vedas and yoga and has practiced and has experiences thereof.

OM

spiridoul · 12-13-2007, 07:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hubert

mann- manas is usually translated as mind as far as I know. The seat of intellect or buddhi is the heart chakra. Mind/manas is related to ajna chakra. Please correct me if I am wrong.

This last post of Guru Kripa yoga is very comforting.

thank you for your input on Steiner; sorry i can't find the thread to post this there.

Fin · 12-14-2007, 04:38 AM

Is it important to fully understand & comprehend the Mantra (in the mind & intellect)? Or is it ok to just chant them without fully understanding its full meaning.

The question I am asking is that are the resonance of the Mantra more important then the meaning?

I find that both the Gayatri Mantra & the Mahamirtyunjaya Mantra very powerful to recite.

Thank you.
Namaste.
Fin

Rashmi · 12-14-2007, 06:16 AM

It is best if you recite mantra after understanding its meaning.You should know the meaning and understand it.Afterwards you can recite it in your heart. Sometimes when i do havan i just recite these mantras , othertimes as per availabity of time i recite every mantra with meaning and offer ahuti.

However once at the begining of recitation recite it with meaning .I have been reciting these mantras since childhood without knowing meaning.Now by Gods grace and kripa of Guru i have understood the meaning and greatness of God.At times when i am fearful or afraid i recite gayatri mantra repeatedly. However the recitation will never go waste, do it full devotion.

I have Given the meaning of both mantras as first time after meeting my guru my darkness has got dispelled and i have got somebody who has true insight of vedas.I consider my merit of past birth are propelling towards vedas and yoga.

God in vedas has said learn vedas from a samadhist mantradrista yogi who has realised him and in whose heart vedas are originated.

OM

Hubert · 12-14-2007, 01:31 PM

Understanding the mantra mentally is one aspect, chanting is another (resonances) but the third and just as important (if not more important) aspect is not it's meaning but truly meaning it. Beleiveing-knowing that this way we actually talk to Divinity, and beleiveing-knowing that Divinity listens and talks to us also. I see mantra as prayer.
Mantra yoga is the safest path, though a slow one. But the lasts often become the firsts ... I believe heaven is packed by mantra yogis, and hell is packed by fallen kundalini ones.

Rashmi · 12-20-2007, 06:10 AM

Dear friends,
namste,
I have always told you that all the upnishads have come from vedas.there are some 18 major upnishads which a soul aspiring self realisation should read. These upnishads are the simple discourses given by mantradrishta rihis to make the disciple understand the subtle and lofty idels of veda on soul and God.
One such upnishad is isha upnishad.The great siddha yogi Sai baba of shirdi how easily made his disciple understand the truth of this upnishad by taking real life example.This is long but do read it and enjoy the nectar of vedic wisdom which purifys the soul:

Ishavasya Upanishad
Das Ganu once started to write a Marathi commentary ont he Ishavasya Upanishad. Let us first give a brief idea of this Upanishad, before proceeding further. It is called a `Mantropanishad', as it is embodied in the Mantras of the Vedic Samhita. It constitutes the last or the 40th Chapter of the Vajasaneyi Samhita (Yajurveda) and it is, therefore, called Vajasaneyi Samhitopanishad. Being embodied in Vedic Samhitas, this is regarded as superior to all other Upanishads, which occur in the Brahmanas and Aranyakas (explanatory treatises on Martras and rituals). Not only this, other Upanishads are considered to be commentaries on the truths mentioned briefly in the Ishavasya Upanishad. For instance, the biggest of the Upanishads, viz, the Brihadaranyaka Upanishad, is considered by Pandit Satwalekar to be a running commentary on the Ishavasya Upanishad.
Professor R.D. Ranade says:- "The Ishopanishad is quite a small Upanishad; and yet it contains many hints which show an extraordinarily piercing insight. Within the short compass of 18 verses, it gives a valuable mystical description of the Atman, a description of the ideal sage, who stands unruffled in the minds of temptations and sorrows; and adumbration of the doctrine of Karma-Yoga as later formulated, and finally a reconciliation of the claims of knowledge and works. The most valuable ideas, that lies at the root of the Upanishad, is that of a logical synthesis between the two opposites of knowledge; and work, which are both required according to the Upanishad to be annulled in a higher synthesis". (page 24 of the Constructive Survey of the Upanishad Philosophy). In another place he says that "The poetry of the Ishopanishad is a Commixture of moral, mystical and metaphysical (ibid, Page 41)".
From the brief description given above about this Upanishad, any one can see how difficult it is to translate this Upanishad in a vernacular language, and brief out its exact meaning. Das Ganu translated it in Marathi 'Ovi'metre, verse by verse, but as he did not comprehend the gist or essence of the Upanishad, he was not satisfied with his performance. He therefore consulted some learned men regarding his doubts and difficulties and discussed with them at great length. They did not solve them nor did they give him any rational and satisfactory explanation. So Das Ganu was a little restless over this matter.
SadGuru only competent and Qualified to Explain
As we have seen, this Upanishad is the quintessence of the Vedas. It is the science of self-realization, it is the scythe or weapon which can rend asunder the bondage of life and death, and make us free. Therefore, he thought, that he who has himself attained self-realization, can only give him the true or correct interpretation of the Upanishad. When nobody could satisfy Das Ganu, he resolved to consult Sai Baba about this. When he got an opportunity to go to Shirdi, he saw Sai Baba, prostrated himself before Him, and mentioned his difficulties about the Ishavasya Upanishad and requested Him to give the correct solution. Sai Baba, blessed him and said- "You need not be anxious, there is no difficulty about the matter, the mind-servant of Kaka (Kakasaheb Dixit) will solve your doubts at Vile Parle, on your way home". The people who went present then and heard this, thought that Baba was joking and said, "How could an illiterate maid-servant solve the difficulties of this nature", but Das Garu thought otherwise. He was sure, that whatever Baba spoke, must come true, Baba's word was the decree of the Brahma (Almighty).
Kaka's Maid-Servant
On fully believing in Baba's words, he left Shirdi and came to Vile Parle (a suburb of Bombay), and stayed with Kakasaheb Dixit. There the next day, when Das Ganu was enjoying his morning nap (some say when he was engaged in worship), he heard a poor girl singing a beautiful song in clear and melodious tones. The subject matter of the song was a crimson coloured Sari, how nice it was, how fine was its embroidery, how beautiful were its ends and borders etc. He liked the song so much that he came out, and saw that it was being sung by a young girl, the sister of Namya, who was a servant of Kakasaheb. The girl was cleaning vessels, and had only a torn rag on her person. On seeing her impoverished condition, and her jovial temperament, Das Ganu felt pity for her and when Rao Bahadur M.V.Pradhan next day gave him a pair of dhotars, he requested him to give a sari to the poor little girl also. Rao Bahadur bought a good Chirdi (small Sari) and presented it to her. Like a starving person getting luckily good dishes to eat, her joy knew to bounds. Next day she wore the new Sari, and out of great joy and merriment, whirled, danced round and played `Fugadi' with other girls and excelled them all. The Day following, she kept the new Sari in her box at home and came with the old and torn rags, but she looked as merry as she did the previous day. On seeing this, Das Ganu's pity was transferred into admiration. He thought that the girl being poor had to wear a torn rag, but now she had a new Sari which she kept in reserve and putting on the old rag, strutted herself, showing no trace of sorrow or dejection. Thus he realized that all our feelings of pain and pleasure depend upon the attitude of our mind. On thinking deeply over this incident, he realized that a man ought to enjoy whatever God has bestowed on him in the firm conviction that He besets every thing, from behind and before, and on all sides and that whatever is bestowed on him by God must be for his good. In this particular case, the impoverished condition of the poor girl, her torn rag and the new Sari, the donor, the dance and the acceptance were all parts of the Lord and pervaded by Him. Hence, Das Ganu got a practical demonstration of the lesson of the Upanishad - the lesson of contentment with one's own lot in the belief that whatever happens, is ordained by God, and is ultimately good for us.

Om

Rashmi · 12-20-2007, 06:12 AM

Rest of the upnishads explanation for you

Unique Method of Teaching
From the above incident, the reader will see that Baba's method was unique and varied. Though Baba never left Shirdi, He sent some to Machhindragad, some to Kolhapur or Sholapur for practising sadhanas. To some He appeared in His usual form, to some He appeared in waking or dreaming state, day or night and satisfied their desires. It is impossible to describe all the methods, that Baba used in imparting instructions to His Bhaktas. In this particular case, He sent Das Ganu to Vile Parle, where he got his problem solved, through the maid-servant. To those, who say that it was not necessary to sent Das Ganu outside and that Baba could have personally taught him, we say that Baba followed the right or best course, or how else could Das Ganu would have learnt a great lesson, that the poor maid-servant and her Sari were pervaded by the Lord.
Now we close the Chapter with another beautiful extract about this Upanishad.
The Ethics of the Ishavasya Upanishad
"One of the main features of the Ishavasya Upanishad, is the ethical advice it offers, and it is interesting to note that the ethics of the Upanishad are definitely based upon the meta-physical position advanced in it. The very opening words of the Upanishad tell us that God pervades every thing. As a corollary from this metaphysical position, the ethical advice it offers is, that a man ought to enjoy whatever God bestows on him in the firm belief, that as He pervades everything, whatever is bestowed on him by God must be good. It follows naturally, that the Upanishad should forbid us from coveting another man's property. In fact, we are fittingly taught here a lesson of contentment with one's own lot in the belief that whatever happens, it is divinely ordained and it is hence good for us. Another moral advice is, that man must spend his life-time always in doing action, specially the karmas enjoined in the Shastras, in a mood of believing resignation to His will. Inactivity, according to this Upanishad, would be the canker of the soul. It is only when a man spends his life-time on doing actions in this manner, that he can hope to attain the ideal of Naishkarmya. Finally, the text goes on to say that a man, who sees all beings in the Self and sees the Self as existing in all beings; in fact, for whom all beings and everything that exists have becomes the Self - how can such a man suffer infatuation? What ground would such a man have for grief? Loathfulness, infatuation and grief verily proceed from our not being able to see the Atman in all things. But a man, who realizes the oneness of all things, for whom everything has become the Self, must ipso facto, cease to be affected by the common foibles of humanity. (Page 169-170 of The Creative Period by Messrs. Belvalkar and Ranade).

I hope we have gained some deep insight into vedas through this upnishad
OM

Rashmi · 12-22-2007, 09:07 PM

Dear friends ,
Namaste and wish you all merry Christmas,

Now few more traditions of India which have roots in Vedas:-

1. Cow :- Hindus do not eat meat or slaughter Cows. God in Vedas has ordered human beings not to eat kill animals until they have turned ferocious and attack human beings.The tradition of shikar is to hunt ferocious animals who are posing threat to human beings, and have turned man eater.But present day people go for shikar and kill animals for pleasure. As souls get bodies of different animals bird, man, women etc as per deeds it performs. A soul is neither male nor female, it is genderless, it is indestructible.So to suffer from its deeds the body is given by the creator by killing others we are doing wrong. God in Vedas have told not to slaughter Cows especially as it is considered equivalent to brahma.So hindus do not kill cows and eat beef.

2. Creamation: Hindus burn the dead bodies in wooden pyre after death with veda mantras as per Vedas. This is the last sanskar to be performed for human body as per Vedas. This is called narmdehyajen. The ashes are immersed in flowing water.After thirteen days therahvee is to be kept . Now it is done as per the Vedas the explanation as per my Guruji I am giving:
In Atharvaveda mantra 8/8/11 'Yamdut' means = 'YAM' means God, and 'dut' means storm, cyclone, flood, earthquake, heavy rains, etc., etc., in mantra the air is Yam. So when a soul is to leave a body then by the power of God sutratma air enters the body and takes the soul out of it then goes to Savita, etc.

In 39th chapter of Yajurveda the process of this cremation is mentioned. This process is also called as "NARMEDH YAJYEN", "PURUSH MEDH YAJYEN" and "DAH KARAM" and "ANTEYESHATI KARAM". Atharvaveda mantra 10/8/26 says "YEH CHAKAR SAH JAJAR" means He (God) who makes the body, He destroys the same one day. Sense of Yajurveda mantra 39/5 is that when the soul leaves the body then the soul wanders in so many places, takes another body according to its previous deeds (karmas).

Yajurveda mantra 39/6 says that the soul after leaving the body first day goes to Savita (sun), second day agnihi (fire), third Vaayu (normal air), fourth Aditya, fifth chandrma (moon), sixth ritu (seasons), seventh marutah, eighth brihaspati (tiniest air), ninth mitrah (breathing), tenth varunah (udan air), eleventh indrah (electricity), twelfth Vishvedevah (in all divine qualities). Then, after wandering in sky, gets body according to previous deeds. So these twelve days are completed, then after 13 days the soul takes another body. Rigveda mandal 10 sukta 135 says that normally soul after getting body faces the result of its past lives' deeds and under influence of illusion (duly attracted towards illusion) does sins and again gets birth to face the sins. The soul is immortal and always separate from body. When an aspirant meets with a learned Acharya and gets spiritual education, then the fourth mantra says that the soul gets salvation

Mantra is APAANG PRAANGETI SWDHAYAA GRIBHITAH AMARTYO MARTYENAA SAYONIHI. TA SHASHVANTA VISHUCHINA VIYANTA NYA NYAM CHIKYURN NI CHIKYURNYAM.

Soul according to its good or bad (APANGETI) takes bodies of animals, birds, insects etc., and (PRANG) bodies of Rishis, Munis, i.e., (uuch Yoni) best bodies after leaving the present body, the soul (SWDHAYAA GRIBHITAH) duly attached with its own power of taking birth according to pious deeds and sins, enters other bodies (AMARTAYAH) though the soul is away from death being immortal but after death of bodies, takes new bodies. These ideas of Vedas has very well been mentioned in Bhagwat Geeta shlok 2/20 wherein Yogeshwar Shri Krishna says (AJO NITYAH SHASHWATOAYAM PURAANNO NA HANYTE HANYAMANNE SHARIRE ) i.e., the soul is (AJAH NITAYAH SHASHWATOH) never takes birth and is eternal (NAHANYATE HANAYMANNE SHARIRE) in fact after death of body too soul is never dead being immortal. (TASHASHVANTA) this process of death and birth of bodies and souls is eternal.

(VISHUCHINA VYANTA) soul and bodies goes far away to different directions [soul goes to Savita etc., {given below} according to Yajurveda chapter 39 and then takes birth and get another bodies and five elements of bodies goes to space and are mixed within air, fire etc., according to Yajurveda mantra 40/15] (ANYAM NICHIKYHU) many learned knows about this fact (ANYAM NICHIKYHU) another who are lack of knowledge of Vedas do not know the fact, i.e., we mostly know our body but not ourselves, i.e., soul. Death is sure i.e., the body will have to be cremated one day.

Sanskar: Hindus especially Brahmins perform all the sanskar as per Vedas, as Vedas knowledge got limited to them in kaliyug. The sanskar as per Vedas to be performed for every soul taken birth as human beings are under the guidance of a learned Guru who knows Vedas because in every sanskar the havan is perforemed with Vedic mantras. These all were performed in Satyug, Dwapur, treta yuga and too by Shri Ram, Shri Krishna etc.

1. Garbhdhan Sanskar --- which is performed just after marriage and before pregnancy to have a good baby.
2. Punsvan sanskar ---which is peformed just after pregnancy of second or third month.
3. Seemantonnayan sanskar ---in 4th, 6th or in 8th month of pregnancy.
4. Jaatkaram Sanskar ---just after birth of a baby i.e., the same day.
5. Naamkaran sanskar ---after 101 days of birth in which name of the baby is announced.
6. Nishkraman sanskar--- when the mother and baby comes out of the house. In the 3rd or 4th month totravel or to go anywhere.
7. Annprasahn sanskar--- in the 6th month of the baby after birth on the same day of birth. In this sanskarthe baby is allowed to take solid food because up to 5th month baby had been taking milk/water only.
8. Churakaram sanskar i.e., Mundan sanskar---in the first or third year.
9. Karanvedh sanskar--- ear piercing ceremony.
10. Upnayan sanskar i.e., allowing baby to go school first time.
11. Vedaarambh sanskar i.e., to start study of Vedas in 6to 8 years.
12. Samavartan sanskar--- i.e., the baby has attained the knowledge of Vedas. It is performed in the age of fourteen years.13. Vivah sanskar i.e., marriage ceremony.
14. Vanprasth sanskar--- in the age of 51 plus.
15. Sanyas sanskar --- in the age of 75 plus or at any age when anyone becomes ascetic.
16. then the last, Anteshti sanskar when death comes. This sanskar is of dead body i.e., cremation
Aswamedh yajen: These yajen was performed by lord Krishna, rama etc and all great ancient kings as per Vedas. It does not mean horses are to be slaughtered as explained by Maxmuller and other western scholars and offered in yajen. It is a mistake to interpret Vedas as per words. It actually is :

The meaning of Ashwamedh Yaj is, "to perform the Yaj for the benefit of the nation". Here the literal meaning of ashwa in Vedas is nation and not horse. Rigveda mantra 5/27/5 states that the person who wishes to obtain chakravarti rajya (to be monarch), he organizes Ashwamedh Yaj. In the Yaj he listens the Vedic mantra and do Yajyen by controlling his senses, organs and mind. Rigveda mantra 5/27/6 states that king and his public must organize Ashwamedh Yaj i.e., to build a long live strong kingdom. In this way king must depute learned acharya of Vedas to spread the knowledge of Vedas all over the nation, so that the people must be learned to be away from illusion and sins and must obey the rules and regulations etc., etc.

Ideally the king must himself organize Yaj and more and more wherein he must sit to listen the Vedas, especially the subject, "how to rule", so that a strong, happy, rich and long live nation is built. So Ashwamedh means nation. Ashwamaed Yaj is performed by a strong king. The main benefit of the Yajyen is that it gives long-life to the entire nation. A horse also is prepared as a part of Yajyen (if done by the king) and is set to roam free. It showcases the power of the king. To challenge rule of a king one has to hold the horse. He has to protect the Ashwa, the horse.

In the Ashwamedh Yaj special Ved mantras are chanted in the Yaj and aahuti are offered. In the Ved mantras the prayer is done from the core of heart, that in the nation Brahmin, Kshatriye, Vaishya and Shudra are born to protect the nation well. Cow, bullock, horse and some strong character-full ladies, girls are born. Pious desires are fulfilled, timely rains occur, the public live long happy life. So the Ashwamedh Yaj is specially organised by the strong king for the benefit of the public. Mantras offered in Ashwamedh Yajyen will bring peace to the nation.

Ashwamedh Yaj which is the best Yaj, is organized by a strong king for the benefit of the Yaj/nation. However, you can organize Yaj for the peace in nation for three days, five days or seven days.

OM

Rashmi · 12-22-2007, 09:16 PM

Casteism and Vedas:This was ploy used by britishers and Christian missionaries to destroy the ancestral heritage of India. The varnna (caste system) to be considered by birth has been made by us post mahabharat war but originally the varnna (Brahmin, kshatriya, Vaishya, Shudra) based on their deeds and not by birth has been made by God, as is also mentioned in Yajurveda mantra 31/11.

Secondly, God does not permit to hate anybody on the earth and those who do, they commit sins. So as per the said Ved mantra, if a Brahmin's boy does not gain Vedic knowledge and thus does not follow the path of Vedas but shows activity of a Kshatriya then according to Vedas, he is Kshatriya and not Brahmin and if Kshatriya gains the quality of Brahmin, he will be Brahmin not Kshatriya. So is the case of rest of the varnnas.Examples are Rishi Vishwamitra who was a king later on he acquired knowledge of Vedas and realized God and became brahmarishi, the nava naths etc.
Gotra system: People in ancient times has formulated this system to maintain lineage.The disiples and sons of rishis after receiving education went to other places and kept name of rishis as gotra to identify from which rishi they have got knowledge and so on. Like people of kashyap Gotra are from the lineage of Kashay rishi, similarly having vashistha as gotra means you are from lineage of vashistha rishi. People from same gotra do not marry as they are considered brother and sister and as per Vedas brother and sister should not marry.
Temple and idol worship: As per Vedas god is formless.He is to be worshipped by yajen andrealised by astanga yoga practice as per samaveda. As matter of fact, idol worship started when Buddhism and Jainism came into existence. The God's worship is in Vedas which emanate direct from God, wherein idol worship is not mentioned.
So, on the basis of the qualities of the God, as mentioned in Vedas, God is known and when an aspirant follows/obeys the path of Vedas i.e., worship, Ashtang yoga practice, listening of Vedas, Yajyen etc., under guidance of an acharya, then he attains Samadhi i.e., realizes God too. So, as per Vedas, no need of idol worship.

If someone believes that God is everywhere then why does he avoid wine, smoking, theft, etc., etc. inside the temple and does outside? Actually realization is subject of deep study of Vedas and to observe thereon. Sagunn means with eternal qualities mentioned in Ved mantras because the meaning of Sa+Gunn means 'with qualities'. So God has unlimited qualities like formless, omnipresent, etc., etc. and nirakar means shapeless. One can not break the rules and regulations of God mentioned in Vedas. Vedas are self-proof and cannot be denied. As per my Guru Ji. How present day all siddha yogis are worshipped . Famous pilgrimage places are associated with these great yogis where they have Done hard tapasya, penance, astanga yoga practice and realized God. That’s the reason when you go to these ancient temples and ask a wish with sincerity and devotion it gets fulfilled by there power of God realization a.Ex sabrimala with Lord Ayappa, shiva ji, rama, Krishna etc, 12 Jyotirlingas, shrines of vaishnao Devi, etc.Gods and Goddess are siddha realised beings may have celestial form earlier i have told in my post where swami Nityananda has said.

Similarly the belief of Hindus that God is present in every being, worshipping trees etc Brahma is every where is as per vedas. Further food is offered to God first as food itself is considered brahmam, further GOD should be remembered first as per vedas. Hindus First offer every thing to God as he is the reason for us and ever present, beyond destruction unlike us. Further many siddha yogis or realised souls have taken birth time and again and told us the importance of everything, so all those also got added and then this tradition has emerged over a pretty long time as i have told you earlier.

So this ends my understanding of indian tradition after studting vedas.

Om

Hubert · 12-23-2007, 05:33 AM

It is always delightful to read your posts, Rashmi.

I also believe God is in everything ... and this is why I am confused by the meaning of transsubstantiation in Eucharist. I believe any bread, any food we eat is the body of Christ. (As God is in everything, or should I just say God is everything). If you believe this, the theory of transsubstantiation is unnecessary.
But I still accept the cerebration of the ritual as a from of worship, as a special moment what evokes the feeling of mystery in the hearts of believers.

10-16-2007, 01:33 AM	#31
Rashmi shatá Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: india Posts: 127	Thank you hubert for your words of appreciation.Infact i daily read the biographies of these perfect masters, to keep me on the path of astanga yoga and veda.This knowledge belongs to humanity, given by God to four rishis of unsexual creation Agni Aaditya, Angira and Vayu at the begining of this creation.There First disciple was brahma.the guru shishya parampara started by brahma is continuing since then.My efforts are to alievate the darknes or misconceptions in the mind of all the practitioners of astanga yoga regarding vedas/yoga by quoting the examples of these perfect masters.And to make you understand the spirituality of Yoga, its origination, which will benefit all.On the path of yoga and devotion to god i have gained this knowledge. These perfect masters will guide you in your journey of self realisation depending on your faith, devotion and steadfastness if you pray to them.indian mind is devoted due to spiritual vibrations.But in this age of darkness(kaliyug) truth is distorted and we have to dispel this darkness from our minds.as and when time permits these jewels of wisdom by these siddha yogis. om __________________ rashmi

10-16-2007, 10:26 PM	#32
Rashmi shatá Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: india Posts: 127	Dear friends, namaste, we often discuss in this forum regarding Guru. in this regard we should always listen to vedas and brahma Gyani.Brahma means God. One who himself after preach of vedas, practice of astanga yoga has realised self and god is called brahma Gyani.God reveals himself to others through these brahma gyanis and Gurus.Further what to read regarding spiritual emancipation ,vedas and shastras, commenties by mantradrishta rishis and brahma gyanis to be read .Due to internet/printing press the knowledge Given by our mantradrishta rishis is now available to us, read it .Those brahma gyanis, philosopher of vedas and yoga have left these valuable knowledge in the form of sutras. If possible do acquire knowledge of sanskrit which is a divine language and mother of all language.Never get disheartened be steadfast in practice of Yoga. God is called athiti in vedas you never know when he plesed with you and reveal you, but you have to sincere urge to seek him.Now the grace of guru by sai baba of shirdi: Mrs. Radhabai Deshmukh There was an old woman by name Radhabai, She was the mother of one Khashaba Deshmukh. Hearing Baba's fame, she came to Shirdi with the people of Sangamner. She took Baba's darshan and was much satisfied. She loved Baba intimately and resolved in her mind, that She should accept Baba as her Guru, and take some Upadesh from Him. She knew nothing else. She determined to fast herself unto death, so long as Baba did not accept her, and give her any Upadesh or Mantra. She stayed in her lodging and left off taking any food or water for three days. I was frightened by this ordeal of the old woman, and interceded with Baba on her behalf. I said, "Deva, what is this You have started? You drag so many persons here. You know that old lady. She is very obstinate and depends on You entirely, She has resolved to fast unto death, if You don't accept and instruct her. If any thing worse happens, people will blame You, and say that Baba did not instruct her, and consequently she met her death. So take some mercy on her, bless her and instruct her." On seeing her determination, Baba sent for her, changed the turn of her mind by addressing her as follows:- "Oh mother, why are you subjecting yourself to unnecessary tortures and hastening your death? You are really My Mother and I am your child. Take pity on Me and hear Me through. I tell you My own story, which if you listen carefully, will do you good. I had a Guru. He was a great Saint and most merciful. I served him long, very long; still he would not blow any Mantra into My ears. I had a keen desire, never to leave him but to stay with and serve him; and at all costs receive some instructions from him. But he had his own way. He first got my head shaved and asked Me two pice as Dakshina. I gave the same at once. If you say that as My Guru was perfect, why should he ask for money and how should he be called desireless? I replied plainly that he never cared for coins. What had he to do with them? His two pice were (1) Firm Faith and (2) Patience or perseverance. I gave these two pice or things to him, and he was pleased. Om __________________ rashmi

10-16-2007, 10:29 PM	#33
Rashmi shatá Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: india Posts: 127	"I resorted to My Guru for 12 years. He brought Me up. There was no dearth of food and clothing. He was full of love nay, he was love incarnate. How can I describe it? He loved Me most. Rare is a Guru like him. When I looked at him, he seemed as if he was in deep meditation, and then we both were filled with Bliss. Night and day, I gazed at him with no thought of hunger and thirst. Without him, I felt restless. I had no other object to meditate, nor any other thing than My Guru to attend. He was My sole refuge. My mind was always fixed on him. This is one pice Dakshina. Saburi (Patience or perseverance) is the other pice. I waited patiently and very long on My Guru and served him. This Saburi will ferry you across the sea of this mundane existence. Saburi is manliness in man, it removes all sins and afflictions, gets rid of calamities in various ways, and casts aside all fear, and ultimately gives you success. Saburi is the mine of virtues, consort of good thought. Nishtha (Faith) and Saburi (Patience) are like twin sisters, loving each other very intimately." "My Guru never expected any other thing from Me. He never neglected Me, but protected Me at all times. I lived with him, and was sometimes away from him; still I never felt the want or absence of his love. He always protected Me by his glance, just as the tortoise feeds her young ones, whether they are near her or away from her on the other side of the river bank, by her loving looks. Oh mother, My Guru never taught Me any Mantra, then how shall I blow any Mantra in your ears? Just remember that Guru's tortoise-like loving glance gives us happiness. Do not try to get Mantra or Upadesh from anybody. Make Me the sole object of your thoughts and actions; and you will, no doubt, attain Paramartha (the spiritual goal of life). Look at Me whole-heartedly, and I in turn look at you similarly. Sitting in this Masjid, I speak the truth, nothing but the truth. No Sadhanas, nor proficiency in the six Shastras, are necessary. Have faith and confidence in your Guru. Believe fully, that Guru is the sole Actor or Doer. Blessed is he who knows the greatness of his Guru and thinks him to be Hari, Hara and Brahma (Trimurti) Incarnate." Instructed in this way, the old lady was convinced; she bowed to Baba and gave up her fast. Hearing this story carefully and attentively, and marking its significance and appropriateness, Hemadpant was most agreeably surprised. Seeing this wonderful Leela of Baba, he was moved from top to toe, he was overflowing with joy, his throat was choked, and he was not able to utter a single word. Shama, on seeing him in this condition asked him, - "What is the matter with you, why are you silent? How many innumerable Leelas of Baba shall I describe!" Then Baba spoke as follows:- "My method is quite unique. Remember well, this one story, and it will be very useful. To get the knowledge (realization) of the Self, Dhyana (meditation) is necessary. If you practice it continuously, the Vrittis (thoughts) will be pacified. Being quite desireless, you should meditate on the Lord, Who is in all the creatures, and when the mind is concentrated, the goal will be achieved. Meditate always on My formless nature, which is knowledge incarnate, consciousness and bliss. If you cannot do this, meditate on My Form from top to toe as you see here night and day. As you go on doing this, your Vrittis will concentrate on one point and the distinction between the Dhyata (meditator), Dhyana (act of meditation), Dhyeya (this meditated upon) will be lost and the meditator will be one with the Consciousness and be merged in the Brahman. The (mother) tortoise is on one bank of the river, and her young ones are on the other side. She gives neither milk, nor warmth to them. Her mere glance gives them nutrition. The young ones do nothing, but remember (meditate upon) their mother. The tortoise glance is, to the young ones, a down-pour of nectar, the only source of sustenance and happiness. Similar is the relation, between the Guru and disciples." When Baba uttered these last words, the chorus of the Arati songs stopped and all cried out loudly in one voice: "Victory be to our Sadguru Sai Maharaj, Who is Existence, Knowledge and Bliss." Dear readers, let us imagine, that we are at this time, standing amongst the crowd in the Masjid; and let us join them in this Jayajayakar. After the Arati ceremony was over, Prasad was distributed. Bapusaheb Jog advanced as usual, and after saluting Baba, gave into His hand a handful of sugar-candy. Baba pushed all this quantity into the hands of Hemadpant and said to him, "If you take this story to heart and remember it well, your state will be sweet as the sugar-candy, all your desires will be fulfilled and you will be happy." Hemadpant bowed before Baba and implored, "Do favour me like this, bless and protect me always." Baba replied - "Hear this story, meditate on it and assimilate its spirit. Then you will always remember and meditate on the Lord, Who will manifest Himself to you." Dear readers! Hemadpant got Prasad of sugar-candy then; and we now get the Prasad of sugar-candy or nectar of this story. Let us drink it to out heart's content, meditate on it, and assimilate it, and be strong and happy by Baba's grace. Amen! __________________ rashmi

10-19-2007, 03:16 AM	#34
Rashmi shatá Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: india Posts: 127	Dear friends, namaste, The knowledge of Brahma or God is very mystic and an able Guru only can tell you and reveal Him to you.All the ecxerpts i have taken for general guidance of every body in this forum.The sidhha purush like Sai baba of shirdi, swami Nityananda, swami ramkrishna param hansa, lord chaitanaya, Swaminarayan, Pad vallabh, Adi shankara,Buddha, trailanga swami rarely take rebirth , as they have perfected this art of self realisation, if they have come on earth again it is on divines will for the benefit of ignorant masses like you and me.The nectar of their wisdom should be read and read again to understand what they intend to say.all were brahma gyanis and highly evovled souls.But still on taking birth again did tapasya and yoga.Please read this account of sai babas guru from his own mouth as recorded by das ganu and translated in english by hemadpant : Hemadpant describes the samsara (visible world) by the allegory of Ashvattha (Banyan) tree which has, in the phraseology of the Geeta, roots above and branches below. Its branches are spread downwards and upwards and are nourished by the gunas (qualities), and its sprouts are the objects of the senses. Its roots, leading to actions, are extended downwards to this world of men. Its form cannot be known in this world, nor its end, its beginning nor its support. Cutting this Ashvattha tree of strong roots with the sharp weapon of non-attachment, one should seek the path beyond, treading which there is no return. For traversing this path, the help of a good guide (Guru) is absolutely necessary. However learned a man may be, or however deep his study of Vedas and Vedangas (sacred literature) may be, he cannot go to his destination safely. If the guide be there to help him and show him the right way, he would avoid the pitfalls and the wild beasts on the journey, and everything will be smooth-sailing. Baba's experience in this matter, the story which He gave out Himself, is really wonderful, which, when attended to, will give you faith, devotion and salvation. The Quest Once four of us were studying religious scriptures and other books and, being thus enlightened, we began to discuss the nature of the Brahman. One of us said that we should raise the self by the Self and not depend on others. To this the second replied that he who controls his mind is blessed; we should be free from thoughts and ideas and there is nothing in the world without us. The third said that the world (phenomenon) is always changing, the formless is eternal; so we should discriminate between the Unreal and the Real. And the fourth (Baba Himself) urged that bookish knowledge is worthless and added, "Let us do our prescribed duty and surrender our body, mind and five pranas (life) to the Guru's feet. Guru is God, all pervading. To get this conviction, strong unbounded faith is necessary." Discussing in this wise, we four learned men began to ramble through the woods in the quest of God. The three wanted to make the quest with their free and unaided intellect. On the way a Vanjari (a man who trades in certain things, such as grain etc. by carrying them on bullock) met us and asked us, "It is hot now, where and how far are you going?". "To search the woods", we replied. He enquired, "On what quest are you bound?" We gave him an ambiguous and evasive reply. Seeing us rambling aimlessly, he was moved and said, "Without knowing the woods fully, you should not wander at random. If you want to walk through forests and jungles, you should take a guide with you. Why do you exert youselves unnecessarily at this sultry noon-time? You may not give out to me your secret quest; still you can sit down, eat bread, drink water, take rest and then go. Be always patient at heart." Though he spoke so tenderly, we discarded his request and marched on. We thought that we were self-contained men and needed nobody's help. The woods were vast and trackless, the trees therein grew so close and tall, that the sun's rays could not penetrate through them; so we lost our way and wandered here and there for a long time. Ultimately through sheer good luck, we came back to the place from were we started. The Vanjari met us again and said, "Relying on your own cleverness you missed your way; a guide is always necessary to show us the right way in small or great matters; and no quest can be successfully carried out on an empty stomach. Unless God wills it, no one meets us on the way. Do not discard offers of food; served dish should not be thrust away. Offers of bread and food should be regarded as auspicious signs of success." Saying this he again offered us food and asked us to be calm and patient. Again we did not like this good hospitality and discarded his offer and went away. Without doing any quest and without taking any food, the three began to move out. So obstinate were they. I was hungry and thirsty and I was moved with the Vanjari's extraordinary love; we thought ourselves very learned but were quite strangers to pity and kindness. The Vanjari was a quite illiterate and unqualified fellow and belonged to a low caste. Still he had love in his heart and asked us to eat the bread. In this way he who loves others disinterestedly is really enlightened and I thought acceptance of his hospitality was the best beginning of getting knowledge. So very respectfully I accepted the loaf of bread offered, ate it and drank water. Then to! The Guru at once came and stood before us, "What was the dispute about?" He asked and I told him everything that had happened. Then he said, "Would you like to come with me? I will show you what you want; but he alone, who believes in what I say, will be successful." The others did not agree to what he said and left him; but I bowed to him reverently and accepted his dictum. Then he took me to a well, tied my feet with a rope and hung me - head downwards and feet up - from a tree near the well. I was suspended three feet above the water, which I could not reach with My hands, nor which could go into my mouth. Suspending me in this manner he went away, no one knew where. After 10 or 12 ghatakas (4 or 5 hours) he returned and taking me out quickly asked me how I fared. "In Bliss supreme, I was. How can a fool like me describe the joy I experienced?" I replied. On hearing my answer the Guru was much pleased with me, drew me near him and stroking my body with his hand kept me with him. He took care of me as tenderly as a mother-bird does of her young ones. He put me into his school; how beautiful it was! There I forgot my parents, all my attachment was snapped and I was liberated easily. I thought that I should embrace his neck and remain staring at him always. If his image were not fixed in my pupils, I would like better to be blind. Such was the school! No one, who entered it once, could return empty-handed. My Guru became my all-in-all, my home and property, mother and father, everything. All my senses left their places and concentrated themselves in my eyes, and my sight was centred on him. Thus was my Guru, the sole object of my meditation and I was conscious of none else. While meditating on him my mind and intellect were stunned and I had thus to keep quiet and bow to him in silence. There are other schools where you see an altogether different spectacle. The disciples go there to seek knowledge and spend their money, time and labour; but ultimately they have to repent. The Guru there boasts of his secret knowledge and his straight-forwardness. He makes a show of his sacredness and holiness, but he is not tender at heart. He speaks a lot and sings his own glory; but his own words do not touch the disciples' hearts and they are not convinced. So far as Self-realization is concerned, he has none. How can such schools be of any use to the disciples and how can they be benefited? The master (Guru) mentioned above was of different type. By his grace, realization flashed upon me of itself, without effort or study. I had not to seek anything, but everything became clear to me as broad day-light. The Guru alone knows how the topsy-turvy Suspension, 'with head down and feet up' can give happiness! Om __________________ rashmi

10-19-2007, 03:25 AM	#35
Rashmi shatá Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: india Posts: 127	Among the four, one was a Karmatha (Ritualistic) who only knew how to observe, and abstain from, certain rites; the second was a Jnani, who was puffed up with pride of knowledge and the third was a Bhakta who surrendered himself completely to God, believing that he was the sole Doer. When they were discussing and arguing, the question of God turned up, and they, depending on their unaided knowledge, went in search of Him. Sai, who was Discrimination and Dispassion incarnate, was one of the four. Being Himself Brahman Incarnate, some may ask, "Why did He mix with them and act foolishly?" He did this for attaining the good of the public, and setting them an example to follow. Though an incarnation Himself, He respected a low Vanjari, by accpeting his food with the firm belief that "Food is Brahman" and showed how those who rejected Vanjari's hospitable offer suffered and how it was impossible to get Jnana without a Guru. The Shruti (Taittiriya Upanishad) exhorts us to honour and worship mother, father and preceptor, and to study (learn and teach) the sacred scriptures. These are the means of purifying our minds and unless this purification is effected, self-realization is not possible. Neither the senses, nor the mind and intellect reach the Self. Modes of proof, such as Perception and Inference will not help us in the matter. It is the grace of the Guru that counts. The objects of our life such as Dharma, Artha and Kama are attainable with our effort, but the fourth object, Moksha (liberation) can only he had with the help of the Guru. In the Darbar of Shri Sai, many personalities appear and play their part; astrologers come and give out their predicitions; princes, noblemen, ordinary and poor men, Sannyasis, Yogis songsters and others come for darshan. Even a mahar comes and, making a Johar (his salutation), says this Sai is the Mai-Baap (True parents), Who will do away with our rounds of births and deaths. So many others such as Jugglers, Gondhalis, the blind and the lame, Nath-panthis, dancers and other players come and are given suitable reception. Biding his own time, the Vanjari also appeared, and played the part assigned to him. Let us now revert to the other story. All these excerpts related to guru from Swami nityananda and sai baba i have given for all of us to understand the efficacy of Guru and the knowledge of Brahma. I do request moderator of this site to allow me post these jewels of wisdom which is beneficial for a practioner of yoga to understand what is yoga and how it opens spiritual gateways.The yogic achievement of these Siddha yogis are unimaginable.the tree on which Swami nityananda used to meditate , the leaves of that tree had cured many illness of devotee which were not cured by doctors medicine etc.Blind people have got there eyes and so on. every act of these siddha yogis is worth mentioning .The control over five elements, five perceptions were simply marvellous.By there touch they can transform the people on spiritual path.Both of them were almost at the same time in India, but never used any foul language against each other or have those human feelings of jealousy.Sai baba had helped gajanan mahahraj, upasani baba and other people.Gajanan maharaj himself was an advanced soul. I hope the underlying meaning of these words by baba and his life is beneficial to you all OM __________________ rashmi

10-25-2007, 03:26 AM	#36
Rashmi shatá Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: india Posts: 127	Dear friends, namaste, salutions to God, Guru and all realised souls, We all(soul) take birth as per deeds.Who do not believe in rebirth i would like to tell.We all are aware of the history of the world after mahabharat war which is accepted by historians, Conquest of christanity, Islam, Persecution of Jews, Hindus, and native tribes on the name of religion, world has fought two world wars. If you consider these deaths and there is only one birth so then the population of the world should be decreasing but here the case is opposite.We are ever increasing.Every day there is a death and birth somewhere in world.A soul leaves the body and after 13 days enters and takes the birth as per its deeds.Listen to all the great siddhas like sai baba, swami Nityananda, swami narayan, Swami sammarth, Swami gajanan maharaj , Rammanna Maharishi etc. by the siddhi of knowing past present and future they have told many times their devottes and bhakta why are they sufferring, why they have bad husbands etc. In this regards vedas states like this: Idea of Yajurveda mantra 39/6 is that after leaving the human body, the soul goes to several matters in the space etc., and then according to good or bad deeds takes next birth. Yajurved mantra 39/7 states that those souls who do sins they take birth with violent nature like wolves, bear and those who give fear to others in human body, they take birth in body with dangerous nature like crocodiles, poisonous snakes, tigers, lions, wild boars etc., those who give fear to others, they will be of timid nature like rabbits,deer etc. Those who give justice and make others fearless, they will take next birth in a fearless nature. Those who are indulged in illusion, they will take birth in a place where the atmosphere will be full of illusion(Yajurveda mantra 40/3 also refers). Those who are learned Yogis but are not yet attained salvation, they will take next birth in a place where there will not be any illusion but divine enlightenment. Those who have not controlled their five senses, five perceptions and mind then in the next birth they will be of restless nature. But those who have controlled their senses etc., will be of calm, peaceful nature. Those who have followed eternal knowledge, they will also be of peaceful nature in the next birth. Atharvaveda mantra 9/10/16 states that those who are not learned in this birth, they will get the birth as "sthavar" rooted plants etc., as birds and as animals etc., and those who are learned they take next birth as rishi-munis. So the soul based on his sins or pious deeds takes birth in upper class or lower class. The above said Atharvaveda mantra also states that the soul in the human body knows each and everything that is each outer matter of the world but due to involvement in illusion, soul does not know himself. As Manusmriti states in shlok 1/43-46 the soul according to deeds takes birth as animal, non-violent deer etc., carnivores like tiger, leopards etc., devils, human beings. Ths said are of "jarayuj" type i.e., those who take birth from their skin i.e., tissue. Soul takes birth as "undaj" type i.e., those who hatch from eggs like birds, snakes, crocodiles, fish, tortoise, etc. Soul takes birth in "Swedaj" type i.e., those who take birth from sweat, humidity, moisture, for-example, lice, mosquitoes, flies, bed-bugs etc. Soul also takes birth in Udbhij i.e., who takes birth from within the earth like plants who emerge from seeds etc., and are stable at one place like trees etc. So there are four above quoted main origin(yonis) of which the total number comes as 84 lakhs. i have asked this question about yonis with support of vedas.i wanted to share this knowledge with you all.dear friends thats why we should shower our love to all animals , plants and look after them.In my next post i will quote examples from life of siddha purush to highlight this point. OM __________________ rashmi

10-26-2007, 03:40 AM	#37
Rashmi shatá Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: india Posts: 127	Dear friends, namaste, The fruits of karma or action is strange. We normal people get swayed by temptations, lust, anger and intellect. When we do yoga by steady practice slowly - 2 your veil is lifted.Now as a soul i am quite concious of my karma and action i do not want to hurt others, or be aparty of any thing bad.Further after reading biographies of many brahma gyanis i have learned that the ultimate aim of life is god realisation.Veda and yoga i have zeroed on after reading and contemplation and my own search. I pray to God please let me the know the truth however bitter it is so that i can correct myself in this birth.Lord rama, krishna, sai baba, Nityananda and other yogis. Thats why i say do yoga and yajna it will help you as a soul in destroying your bad or evil karmas.Now one incident as told by brahma gyani sai baba of shirdi on how we pay for our karmas: Blessed is the face of Sai. If we cast a glance at Him for a moment, He destroys the sorrow of many past births and confers great bliss on us; and if He looks at us with grace, our bondage of Karma is immediately snapped away and we are led to happiness. The river Ganges washes away the dirt and sins of all people who go to her for a bath; but she intently longs for the saints to come to her and bless her with their feet and remove all the dirt (sins) accumulated in her. She knows for certain that this accumulation can only be removed by the holy feet of the saints. Sai is the crest-jewel of the saints, and now hear from Him the following purifying story. The Snake and the Frog Sai Baba said - "One morning after taking My breakfast I strolled along till I came to a small river bank. As I was tired, I rested there, washed My hands and feet and had a bath and felt refreshed. There was a foot-path and a cart-track sheltered by shady trees. The breeze was also blowing gently. As I was preparing to smoke chillim (pipe), I heard the croaking of a frog. I was striking the flint and lighting the fire, when a traveller turned up, sat by My side, bowed to Me and politely invited Me to his house for meals and rest. He lit up the pipe and handed it over to Me. The croaking was heard again and he wanted to know what it was. I told him that a frog was in trouble and was tasting the bitter fruit of its own karma. We have to reap now the fruit of what we sow (do) in our past life, and there is no use in crying about it. Then he smoked and handed over the pipe to Me and said that he would go there in person and see for himself. I told him that a frog was caught by a big snake and was crying. Both were very wicked in their past life and were now reaping the fruit of their actions in these bodies. He went out and found that a huge black serpent was holding a big frog in its mouth. He turned to Me and said that in about 10 or 12 minutes the frog would be eaten up by the snake. I said, "No, this can't be. I am its father (protector) and I am here now. How shall I allow the snake to eat it up, am I here for nothing? Just see how I release it." After smoking again, we walked on to the place. He was afraid and asked Me not to proceed further as the snake might attack us. Not minding him, I went ahead and addressed the creatures thus:- "Oh Veerbhadrappa, has not your enemy Bassappa yet repented though he has been born as a frog, and you too, though born as a serpent, still maintain bitter enmity against him? Fie upon you, be ashamed, give up your hatred now and rest in peace." Hearing these words, the snake left the frog quickly and dived into the river and disappeared. The frog also jumped away and hid itself in the bushes. The traveller was much surprised; he said that he could not understand how the snake dropped the frog and disappeared at the words uttered, who was Veerbhadrappa and who was Basssappa, and what was the cause of their enmity. I returned with him to the foot of the tree and after sharing a few puffs of smoke with him I explained the whole mystery to his as follows:- There was ancient holy place sanctified by a temple of Mahadev about 4 or 5 miles from My place. The temple was old and dilapidated. The residents of the place collected funds for its repairs. After a large amount was collected, arrangement for worship was made and plans with estimates for repairs were prepared. A rich local man was appointed the Treasurer and the whole work was entrusted to him. He was to keep regular accounts and be honest in all his dealings. He was a first class miser and spent very little for the repairs, which consequently made very little progress. He spent all the funds, swallowed some amount himself and spent nothing from his pocket. He had a sweet tongue and was very clever in offering plausible explanations regarding the poor and tardy progress of the work. The people again went to him and said that unless he lent his helping hand and tried his best, the work would not be complete. They requested him to work out the scheme and again collected subscriptions and sent the amount to him. He received it, but sat as quiet as before without making any progress. After some days, God (Mahadev) appeared in his wife's dream and said to her - "You get up, build the dome of the temple, I will give you a hundred-fold of what you spend." She told this vision to her husband. He was afraid that it would involve him in some expenses and therefore laughed it out saying that it was a mere dream, a thing not to be relied and acted upon, or else why did not God appear to him and tell him? Was he far off from her? This looks like a bad dream, having for its object the creation of ill feeling between husband and wife. She had to remain quiet. God does not like big subscriptions and donations collected against the wishes of the donors, but He likes ever trifling amounts given with love, devotion and appreciation. Some days after, God again appeared in her dream and said - "Do not bother yourself about your husband and the collections with him. Don't press him to spend any amount for the temple. What I want is, feeling and devotion. So give, if you like, anything of your own." She consulted her husband about this vision and decided to give God her ornaments given by her father. The miser felt disconcerted and decided to cheat even God in this item. He undervalued the ornaments at Rs.1,000/- and bought them himself and in lieu of the amount gave a field to God as endowment or security. The wife agreed to this. The field or land was not his own, it belonged to one poor woman named Dubaki who mortgaged it to him for Rs.200/-. She was not able to redeem it for long. So the cunning miser cheated all, his wife, Dubaki and even God. The land was sterile, uncultivated and worth nothing and yielded nothing, even in best seasons. the rest post i am pasting in next thread __________________ rashmi

10-26-2007, 03:41 AM	#38
Rashmi shatá Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: india Posts: 127	Thus ended this transaction and the land was given in the possession of the poor priest who was pleased with the endowment. Sometime later on, strange things happened. There was a terrific storm and heavy down-pour of rain; lightning struck the house of the miser, when he and his wife both died. Dubaki also breathed her last. In the next life, the rich miser was born at Mathura in a Brahmin family and was named Veerbhadrappa. His devout wife was born as the daughter of the priest of the temple and was named Gouri. The woman Dubaki (the mortgagor) was born as a male in the family of the Gurav (attendent) of the the temple and was named Chenbassappa. The priest was a friend of Mine, He often came to Me, chatted and smoked with Me. His daughter Gouri was also devoted to Me. She was growing fast and her father was seeking a good husband for her. I told him not to worry about this as the bridegroom himself would come seeking her. Then there came a poor boy named Veerbhadrappa of their caste, wandering and begging his bread to the priest's house. With My consent Gouri was given in marriage to him. He was also at first devoted to Me as I recommended his marriage with Gouri. Even in this new life he was hankering after money and asked Me to help him to get it as he was leading a married man's life. Strange things happened. There was a sudden rise in prices. By Gouri's good luck, there was a great demand for land and the endowment land was sold for one lakh of rupees (100 times the worth of her ornaments). Half the amount was paid in cash and the remaining was to be paid in 25 instalments of Rs. 2,000/- each. All agreed to this transaction, but began to quarrel over the money. They came to Me for consultation. I told them that the property belonged to God and was vested in the priest and Gouri was his sole heiress and proprietress and no amount should be spent without her consent and that her husband had no right whatsoever to the amount. Hearing my opinion Veerbhadrappa was wroth with Me and said that I wanted to establish Gouri's claim and embezzle her property. Hearing his words, I remembered God and kept quiet. Veerbhadrappa scolded his wife (Gouri) and she came to Me at noon and requested Me not to mind the words of others and not to discard her as she was My daughter. As she thus sought My protection I gave her a pledge that I would cross seven seas to help her. Then that night Gouri had a vision. Mahadev appeared in her dream and said - "The whole money is yours, do not give anything to anybody, spend some amount for temple purposes in consultation with Chenbassappa and if you want to use it for some other purpose, consult Baba in the Masjid (Myself)." Gouri told Me the vision and I gave her the proper advice in the matter. I told her to take the principal or capital amount to herself, give half the amount of interest to Chenbassappa and that Veerbhadrappa had nothing to do in the matter. While I was thus talking, both Veerbhadrappa and Chenbassappa came there quarreling. I tried My best to appease them and told them God's vision to Gouri. Veerbhadrappa got wild and angry and threatened to kill Chenbassappa cutting him to pieces. The latter was timid, he caught my feet and sought my refuge. I pledged Myself to save him from the wrath of his foe. Then after some time Veerbhadrappa died and was born as a snake and Chenbassappa died and was born as a frog. Hearing the croaking of Chenbassappa and remembering my pledge, I came here, saved him and kept My word. God runs to His devotees for help in times of danger. He saved Chenbassappa (the frog) by sending Me here. All this is God's Leela or sport." The Moral The moral of the story is that one has to reap what one sows, and there is no escape unless one suffers and squares up one's old debts and dealings with others, and that greed for money drags the greedy man to the lowest level and ultimately brings destruction on him and others. i hope you have understood my previous post with support from vedas on rebirth and karma. OM __________________ rashmi

10-28-2007, 01:22 AM	#39
Rashmi shatá Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: india Posts: 127	Dear friend, Namaste, Few mantras from vedas with meanings for you all, with the practice of yoga , kill your sorrows, read these mantras and understand God and vedas. If possible do yajen. Something which is not possible in physical world is possible in spiritual world. By the grace and permission of Guru and God i am putting for you all. Rigveda mantra 2/12/2 YAHA PRITHIVEEM VYATHAMAANAAMADRINGHADYAHA PARVATAANPRKUPITAAM ARAMNNAAT. YO ANTRIKSHAMA VIMAME VAREEYO YO DYAAMASTABHNAATSA JANAS INDRAHA. O! (JANASAHA) learned man (YAHA) he who (VYATHAMAANAAM) rotating (PRITHIVEEM) earth (ADRINGHAT) holds (YAHA) who (PRAKUPITAAN) like angry enemies (PARVATAAN) to clouds (ARAMNNAT) disperses (YAHA) who (VAREEYAHA) huge extensive ( ANTARIKSHAM) space (VIMAME) gives respect i.e., holds and (YAHA) who (DYAM) light (ASTBHNAAT) holds (SAHA) the God (INDRAHA) Himself is Almighty God who too disperses the matters like sun. So amongst the unlimited names of God based on His divine qualities, His one name is also Sun. he is the only God who is to be known. Idea: O! learned man he who holds the rotating earth, who disperses the clouds like angry enemies, who gives respect i.e., holds the huge, extensive space, who holds light i.e., who is form of light and gives light to other heavenly bodies, He is only God who is to be known. Atharavaveda 12/1/11 GIRYASTE PARVATA HIMVANTORANNYAM TE PRITHVI SYONAMASTU. <br BABHRUM KRISHNNAM ROHINNEEM VISWAROOPAAM DHRUVAAM BHOOMIM PRITHIVEEMINDRAGUPTAAM. AJEETOHATO AKSHATODHYASHTHAAM PRITHIVEEMAHAM. (PRITHVI) O! earth (TE) your (GIRYAHA) hills and (HIMVANTAHA) ice laiden peaks (PARVATAAHA) mountains and (TE) yours (ARANNYAM) forests (SEYONAM) delightful to heart (ASTU) may. Idea: O! earth may your mountains, ice-laiden peaks and your forests be delightful to out heart. (BABHRUM) nursing (KRISHNNAAM) ploughing (ROHINNEEM) fertile (VISHWARUPAAM) of several beautiful shapes (DHRUVAAM) of de-shaped nature (BHOOMIM) place of shelter (PRITHVEEM) extensive (INDRAGUPTAAM) protected by warriors (PRITHVEEM) of earth (AJEETAHA) without being destroyed and (AHATAHA) without being killed (AKASHATAHA) without being wounded (AHAM) may I (ADHI ASTHAM) be establisher/caretaker. Idea: O! God without being destroyed, killed or wounded may I be establisher/caretaker of the earth which nurses, is plough-able, fertile, of several beautiful shapes, which is of de-shaped nature, is a place of shelter, extensive, protected by warriors. Atharavaveda 12/1/17 VISHWASVAM MAATARAMOSHDHEENAAM DHRUVAAM BHUMIM PRITHIVEEM DHARMANNA DHRITAAM. SHIVAAM SYONAMANU CHAREM VISHWAHA. (VISHWASVAM) PRODUCER OF ALL (AUSHADHEENAAM) crops, vegetation, medicinal plants (MATRAM) mother land (DHRUVAAM) firm (BHOOMIM) place of shelter (DHARMANNA) which by its nature of holding and deeds (DHRITAAM) has been held. (SHIVAAM) it is beneficial (SEYONAAM) delightful to heart (PRITHIVEEM ANU) behind the earth (VISHWAHA) in various kinds (CHAREM) to follow. Idea: O! God may we follow in various kinds, the earth which is the beneficial and delightful to heart. The earth is our mother. It is of firm nature, is beneficial, delightful to heart, shelter giving, producer of all crops, vegetation, medicinal plants and exhibits its nature of holding all matters and creates deeds. Yajurveda mantra 32/4 YEN DYOORUGRA PRITHVI CHA DRIDHA YEN SWA STBHITAM YEN NAKHA YO ANTARIKSHE RAJSO VIMANAHA KASMI DEVAI HAVISHA VIDHEMA. (YEN) the God by whom (UGRA) strong light emitting (DYOHO) heavenly bodies (CHA) and ( PRITHVI) earth and space (DRIDHA) established firmly. Meaning: The God by whom the strong light emitting heavenly bodies and earth and space etc., have been firmly established. (YEN) and the God by whom (SWAHA) un-finishing merriment (STABHITAM) is held and (YEN)the God by whom (NAKAHA)salvation is held and (YAHA) the God (ANTARIKSHE) in the space (RAJSAHA) universe/world (VIMANAHA) specially creates (KASMAI) i.e., shape of merriment too. KASMAI word is made of 'KUM' dhatu of Sanskrit which gives the meaning of merriment. (DEVAAYA) for the dev i.e., God. (HAVISHA) by offerings i.e., aahuti, Yaj /yoga-abhyaas i.e., preach of ashtang yoga. It should be noted that worship of God. If we offer aahuti on havan kund in burning fire, do Yaj and ashtang yoga practice (VIDHEMA) VI=special, DHEM=worship. In this way we do the best worship. Idea: The worship is of no use if we do not know the real qualities of God. The God has unlimited unchangeable and immortal qualities, which have been mentioned in the Vedas by God Himself. In this mantra some of the qualities are seen. The idea of mantra is that who is God to worship? Mantra says the light emitting heavenly bodies like sun, moon, stars etc., gives us invaluable light etc., and the earth/space where we reside all the said universe is held and created by God only. He is the shape of merriment and the worshiper is provided with the merriment. Salvation is also held by God and God is only powered to bless to real worshipper with the salvation where every sorrows etc., are ended. There is no other God and will never be in future who can do this task. So we have to worship only the God who is one and will remain unchanged, who creates the universe etc., is formless and immortal. May we all become like Lord Krishna, rama, Bhisma and all vedanisht people who have attained God and eternal merriment __________________ rashmi

10-31-2007, 05:03 AM	#40
Rashmi shatá Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: india Posts: 127	Dear friends, namaste, Every time i tell you about vedas and its greatness as i have read and understood. I will tell about this sacred vedas as told by brahma gyani.There is one more brahma gyani who is contemporary of shirdi sai baba, he is Gajanan maharaj of Shegaon.Both of them were brahma leen purush. you and me are mere mortals who perceive everything by senses, intellect and mind. Where as a brahmaleen purush sees God in every being.He has crossed that stage and become one with God. So we should listen to such brahma gyanis what he says of vedas: While Maharaj lived at the house of Khandu Patil, there came some Telangi Brahmins. These Telangi Brahmins are known to be quite orthodox, learned and in charge of the authority of Vedic knowledge, but their biggest drawback is that they are somewhat greedy for money. They came to Shri Maharaj with the hope of getting some money from Him. When they came, Shri Maharaj was sleeping. The Brahmins started reciting Vedic hymns loudly to awaken Shri Maharaj. There was some mistake in their recitation, but they did not correct it, so Shri Maharaj got up and said to them, "Why have you become Vedic? You are lowering the greatness of Vedas unnecessarily. This knowledge is not for the purpose of running a business but for the salvation 0f human beings. At least show some respect to the saffron head-dress, which indicates that you are a Vedic. I will now recite the hymns and you repeat the same as I pronounce. Do not misguide innocent poor believers." Saying so Shri Maharaj recited the same chapter of Vedas, this was being recited by these Brahmins incorrectly. His pronunciation was clear, loud and there was not a single mistake in His recitation. It appeared as if Vashistha himself was reciting the holy Vedas. The Brahmins were astonished and felt embarrassed to even lift their faces. The analogy can be compared to a lit candle fantasizing that it has better capacity to spread light around itself than the sun itself. The Brahmins first thought that Shri Maharaj was a mad person, but now found Him to be a learned saint. They were convinced that all the four Vedas were on the tip of His tongue. They took Shri Maharaja to be a God incarnate and a Brahmin by caste - a yogi free of any bondage or attachment, and because of their good deeds of previous life, they believed they were fortunate enough to get the "Darshan" of such a Godly saint. Shri Maharaja asked Khandu Patil to give them a rupee each as "Dakshina". The Brahmins accepted this dakshina and happily went away. Like sai baba of shirdi, his birth details and other things are shrouded in mystery. Just one fine day he was seen in shegaon and was sighted by two people who thought him earlier to be a mad man but later on realised him to be a great saint. It is belived among the masses in india that the great swami samarth of akkalkot was the Guru of sai baba and gajanan maharaj. Swami sammarth was lord datttreya. please do read about him, a real brahma purush like him, sai baba, nityananda, gajanan maharaj, ramkrishna paramhansa, rammana rishi has made India a Tirth.Since time immerorial many yogis have done penance and tapasya in this pious land to realise the higher truths in life by Vedas and yoga. Further we had a discussion on Bhakti yoga, Karma and Gyan Yoga.Please listen what this brahma gyani has said and try to understand it: Once, Shri Maharaj went to Akot to meet his saint brother Narsinghji, who was a disciple of Kotasha. Although Maratha by caste, he had become dear to Shri Vithala by his Bhakti (devotion). Since I have narrated his detail life in “Bhaktileelamrut", I don't repeat in here. Akot is 36 miles to the north-east of Shegaon and Gajanan Maharaj went there with the speed of wind. Shri Narsinghji was staying in the dense forest near Akot to get solitude. This forest, without any habitants, was very dense with big trees, creepers, wild grass and many snakes in it. In such dreadful forest Shri Narsinghji was living all alone. Shri Gajanan went there to meet him. Water mixes with water and like things merge with each other. Unlike things never mix with each other. So looking at Shri Gajanan, Shri Narsinghji was happy beyond description. One was Hari and the other Har, one was Rama, while other, the son of Vasudeo-Devaki. One was Ganga and the other that of Godavari. One was the Kohinoor, and the other Kaustubha. One was the Vashistha and the other, son of Anjani. Both of them met each other and were very happy. They sat near each other and exchanged their experiences. Shri Gajanan said, "Narsinha, you have done well by leading a family life. I renounced that and followed the path of Yoga, to know the ultimate reality, the "Brahma". In this path of yoga, many strange things, incomprehensible to the common man, happen, and to hide them I, many times, behave like a mad man. To know the ultimate Truth there are three paths - Karma, Bhakti and Yoga. Apparently they look like three different paths, but in reality they reach the same goal. If a yogi feels proud of his path, he will remain away from the ultimate Truth. He should keep himself clean from the effect of Yogakriya, like a lotus leaf. Then only he can know the ultimate Truth. Same is the case with family life. You should not have attachment with your family. A pebble remains in water, but does not allow the water to enter it. Such should be your behaviour in family life - free from any expectations and with full concentration in Almighty. Then nothing is impossible. You, me and God are one, and the people too are not different from Him." Shri Narsinghji said, "I am grateful to you for meeting me. This "Prapanch" is unreal like the shadow at noon. I will follow your advice, but keep on coming to me. Everything is predestined in this world, and we have to perform our duty in this life as per desire of God. My only, request is that you should come frequently to meet me as I am your younger brother. Just like Bharat, waiting at Nandigram for Shri Ram, I am here at Akot for you. With your yogic achievements, it is very easy for you to come here. A yogi, without touching anywhere, can traverse around the universe in minutes." With intimate love for each other, they were speaking all that night. Real saints behave like this only, but the hypocrites quarrel with each other. These hypocrites should not be accepted as Guru as they are like a broken ship on the sea. They receive a lot of publicity, but carefully we should discard them. Living in a "math" or learning an art of composing poems does not make one a saint, but only self knowledge does it. Can we accept gold-coated articles as gold, or a prostitute as a house wife? These two saints were real and pious. When people knew that Shri Gajanan Maharaj had come to meet Shri Narsinghji, They thought it to be the confluence of Godavari and Bhagirathi and by going there they could get the satisfaction of taking a dip in that confluence. So the people with coconuts in their hands started rushing to the forest. But Shri Gajanan, with the permission of Shri Narsinghji had already left and all the people were disappointed. I hope this must have enlightened us. Om __________________ rashmi

11-02-2007, 11:07 PM	#41
Rashmi shatá Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: india Posts: 127	Dear friends, namaste, In india this is the time of festivals.Wish you all a very happy diwali, though you all do not celebrate it.This festival is celebrated in the rememberence of Lord Rama who returned to ayodhya after a exile of 14 years with his wife.I am going on a vacation and you will not be hearing me for a month. may god bless all om __________________ rashmi

12-10-2007, 04:04 PM	#43
Hubert sahásra Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Romania Posts: 1,173	Sorry, I just noticed your question. It is in "The East in the Light of the West" ... it also has a subtitle, The children of Lucifer and the brothers of Christ. Boohoo !!! __________________ "wahetever we deny or embrace, for worse or for better, we belong togheter" Pat Benatar

12-10-2007, 04:38 PM	#44
Hubert sahásra Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Romania Posts: 1,173	To Rashmi ... I learnt gayatri mantra and did use it with success. It has a great power. I have grown great respect for it as I found that there can be a link made with my religion. First, the word "savitur" catched my attention. It reminded me of the word "saviour". Don't ask me why ... it just popped in. But it did not let me rest and found about Savitr on wiki: "In Vedic religion, Savitr* (stem), Savitā (nominativesingular) is a* solar deity (see Deva) and one of the Adityas. His name is in Vedic Sanskrit meanings "impeller, rouser, vivifier". Savitr is described in the Vedas as having golden arms, hands, hair, etc. He is sometimes identified with, and at other times distinguished from, the chief Sun deity Surya. A number of beautiful Vedic hymns are invoked in his praise. He is the god of the Sun at Sunrise andSunset, and was most often invoked in the latter role in Vedic hymns." Steiner tought that the Christ has come through a Sun being. The transfiguration scene from the gospels of the New Testament on mount Hermon describes the saviour with His face glowing like the Sun. Steiner said that Zarathustra (Zoroaster) an initiate ruler of the proto-persians (preshistoric cultural age in the persian geographic area) saw the descending Christ in the Sun's aura. Too much coincidence to neglect, I am not jumping to any conclusions but I think this entitles me to make this intuitive connection anytime I chant this mantra. This also worths investigation, for the greater good of understanding each other's religion and marvel of the hidden, common truths. I believe with fervor that all great religions represent the same facets of an universal truth, and this being so without to take away anything from any of them. Christianity in it's outer expression cannot match the insight and revelation of the Vedas, but an esoteric christianity could use the depths of India's inner knowledge just as India uses the outer achievments of western culture. Please share if you know more of Savitr. __________________ "wahetever we deny or embrace, for worse or for better, we belong togheter" Pat Benatar

12-10-2007, 11:19 PM	#46
Rashmi shatá Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: india Posts: 127	Dear friends, namaste, I have been on a long vacation to a place called amaipakkam in chennai near mahabalipuram.Have seen 1400 years old temple at tripurkundalam where the great siddha yogi Lord shiva and siddha yogin parvati his consort is worshipped which has its own legend.But the temple was magnificent and the experience too visit was truly divine.Lord Shiva, was a great siddha yogi same is his consort parvati/sati etc. He was there prior to birth of Lord Rama. He is always shown engrossed in state of samadhi enjoying somaras.Soma ras or soma in vedas is described as a divine merriment/bliss which a yogi enjoys when he is in a state of samadhi.People think it is alcohol this is not correct.Shiva is always in a state of samadhi. The third eye represented is a spiritual eye which is awakened in him by the divine powers and hard practice of astanga yoga.Incidentally all 12 Jyotirlinga in india are associated with this great siddha yogi.Swami Nityananda is believed to be the same soul.Till the time he was alive there was a pertpetual water which was flowing on a ancient shiva linga at a shiva temple at Ganeshpuri.Once a devotee came for his darshan at Ashram at Ganeshpuri. He could not find him there, he got dejected and was going back, on his return journey he went to this shiva temple, he saw nityananda there with his one leg on Shivlinga and having trishul.As per vedas That formless omniscient ever present God has no husband, wife, he never takes birth or dies.With his will and dream during the day of brahma the world is running.The law of karma is the basis of all beings.However the highly realised souls on divines will take birth to guide us and show the correct path whenever dharma is on decline.This is referred as incarnation. Essentially what i have understood is mainly all the traditions of India have roots in vedas.However post mahabharat war due to decline of knowledge of vedas and sorrows people had forgotten the root(vedas) and it became traditions.Lets have a look at all these: 1. Respect of parents : As per vedas there are five alive Gods and 33 non alive Gods. Parents are among two alive Gods (Mother and father). All siddha yogis have emphasised on respecting parents and treating them at par with God. 2. Guru shishya parampara. This itself have its root in vedas. The first Guru of Four rishis at the bigning of creation was almighty God. Then this tradition continued.Further all the arts like classical music, dance, Brahma Gyan have Guru shishya parampara.The highest Knowledge in the world is Brahma Gyan can only be imparted by a worthy Guru. On this i have dealt at length. 3. Marraiage: The indian marriage has vedic roots.First Garlands are exchanged between bride and groom.A pious fire is lighted as per vedas,The hymns from vedas along with ahutis are chanted and sapta padi or seven vows are being taken by bride and Groom.The marraigae is conducted by a person who knows vedas and its procedures.Vedas doesnot talk of Dowry or other things.As per vedas the age of marriage for Girl is 18 and boys 21.Bal vivah all have come post islamic invasion and superstitions.As under the islamic rule girls were abducted and raped and it was justified under islams tenets. so to avoid all this bal vivah, parda pratha have come got included.The custom of arranged marriage is as per vedas.there are sixteen typers of marriage as per vedas. 4. Women. In vedas it is told to respect women. It is said where women are given and treated with respect there resides God and that house will be full of wealth and happiness.Women have equal right as men in vedas they were brahma gyanis, learned of vedas.Even during Shankrachayas time in 5th century a learned lady had a debate with him.This clearly reflects the position of women prior to invasions.Devi sita, Draupadi all were taught vedas and were highly learned as described in ramayana and mahabharat.They were bachelors like men too.For example Gargi who was Guru of Sita was not married.Shabri who was a shudra as per her profession has patanga muni as her Guru.Her conduct and knowledge is evident in Ramayana. 5. Chastity and Brahmacharya. Women are always advised to be chaste and pativrata. In vedas God has said he has to obey the words of a chaste and pativatra wife. sati Anusuya, savitri and Sita are known as pativrta and chastye wife.Who have always obeyed there husband.Sati anusuya with her chastity has turned siddha yogis like brahma, vishnu and mahesh into kids.Men are advised to follow brahmacharya. AS a married persons men and women are too advised to follow brahmacharya.The aim of marriage is not sex, it is togetherness and spiritual emancipation of soul along with other roles. God in vedas has said he will always full fill words of a brahma Yogi/saint and a chaste/pativrata wife.When we read all these ancient Granths written by rishis you come to know Animals and man were at peace.Animals would follow instructions of rishis, even ferocious animals were living in peace with each other.This i will explain afterwards with examples from brahmagyanis life. thats it Om __________________ rashmi Last edited by Rashmi; 12-10-2007 at 11:26 PM.

12-10-2007, 11:29 PM	#47
Pandara sahásra Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: South Africa Posts: 1,183	Hi Rashmi, You talk of the five alive Gods and name two of them (mother and father), who are the other three? __________________ Blessings & Om's Pandara _____________________________________________ http://www.oneyogalife.wordpress.com Live everyday as if it is a miracle - Einstein

12-10-2007, 11:31 PM	#48
spiridoul dashan Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 12	welcome back it sounds very interesting. __________________ Yoga teaches us to cure what need not be endured and endure what cannot be cured. ~B.K.S. Iyengar

12-13-2007, 12:55 AM	#51
Rashmi shatá Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: india Posts: 127	Dear frinds, namaste, The five alive Gods as per vedas are: 1. Almighty God 2. Mother 3. father 4. Guru 5. Athithi Only these gods are to be worshipped.Further Savitur has come from savitaha .In gayatri mantra it has been referred to that formless, omniscient God who is creator .God has many names in vedas .At times he is referred as Vishnu, Brahma, Shiva, Vasudev etc.There is only one God rest all gods referred are highly emancipated and realised souls with different forms. However prior to mahabharat world was following vedic culture.People were keeping beautiful names from vedas.And many souls have realsied God on this Path. Jesus himself was a realised soul from Birth.After liberation/moksha and self realisation soul is free from the debt of karmas.Whenever such soul assumes bodies it remebers everything depending on the stages of realisation.As the kowledge of vedas after realistion is immortal.This is clear from lives of Lord Krishna, Swami Nityananda, sai baba of shirdi, Swami samarth and shri Guru(narsinghmendra saraswati) and jesus too.Such Soul can take birth anywhere as per divine will and purpose Please do read biographies of this highly realised siddha yogis who have assumed bodies in recent 600 years, you will understand better what i say.Further your senses will get purify and you will get insight as per your devotion, may get spiritual experience too : 1. Swami Nityananda 2 Swami ramakrishna Paramhansa 3.Swami sammarth of akkalkot/shriguru/padvallabh, www.swamisamarth.org 4.Sai baba of shirdi. 5.Shri Gajanan maharaj 6.Swaminarayan 7. Lord chaitanaya. 8.Trailangswami, there is no biography of him but i have read only a small account of his life further you read autobiography of yogi.you will understand much better After reading these siddha yogis you will understand Lord Krishna/rama/sage vasistha etc. As per my Guru: The target of a human life to realize truth under the guidance of a Guru even continues (in) the family life like Shri Ram, sita etc., or a brahamcharya life like Bal brahmcharini Gargi who was the Guru of king Janak. But now a days due to attraction in materialistic articles only the people have become ignorant about the path of eternal spiritualism for which we have been blessed with a human body. God is not seen with eyes etc., but God is only realized by a Rishi who knows Vedas philosophy and has practiced ashtang yoga philosophy. Geeta shlok 7/19 also refers. The Rishis have explained their experiences of realizing God and other benefits in their shastras/upnishads etc. And they have clarified in their holy books that they got the knowledge from Vedas traditionally in Guru shishya method. So now a days there may also be the Rishi of such kind. Now there is lack of study of Vedas, therefore people are totally unable to justify that who is the real Guru. Saamveda mantra 164 wherein it is said," AA TU AA IT" i.e., come, come and come here "NISHIDAT" i.e., sit down please and "INDRAM PRAGYAT" i.e., recite and learn and even sing the reality of Almighty God. Saam veda mantra 252 says YATHA TRISHYAN GAURAH just like a thirsty animal like deer etc., "APA KRITAM IRRINM ETI" goes to a water tank in a jungle. Similarly NA APITEVE KANVESHU we must be desirous of getting contact with learned Guru TUYAM AW AA GAHI SACHA PIB to realize immortal God. So now a days to be thirsty one to realize God or to do pious deeds or to worship or to contact with spiritual master has been a tough taskdue to attraction towards materialistic articles. But Vedas says about the truth that the first birth of a man or woman is from parents which is like darkness, selfishness, being full of illusion. So there is a word in Vedas Dwij, Dwi= second, ja means janam i.e.,birth. So in human life one has to take second birth. This birth is taken from a spiritual master, real Guru who knows eternal philosophy of Vedas and yoga and has practiced and has experiences thereof. OM __________________ rashmi

12-14-2007, 04:38 AM	#53
Fin shatá Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: England UK Posts: 150	Is it important to fully understand & comprehend the Mantra (in the mind & intellect)? Or is it ok to just chant them without fully understanding its full meaning. The question I am asking is that are the resonance of the Mantra more important then the meaning? I find that both the Gayatri Mantra & the Mahamirtyunjaya Mantra very powerful to recite. Thank you. Namaste. Fin

12-14-2007, 06:16 AM	#54
Rashmi shatá Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: india Posts: 127	It is best if you recite mantra after understanding its meaning.You should know the meaning and understand it.Afterwards you can recite it in your heart. Sometimes when i do havan i just recite these mantras , othertimes as per availabity of time i recite every mantra with meaning and offer ahuti. However once at the begining of recitation recite it with meaning .I have been reciting these mantras since childhood without knowing meaning.Now by Gods grace and kripa of Guru i have understood the meaning and greatness of God.At times when i am fearful or afraid i recite gayatri mantra repeatedly. However the recitation will never go waste, do it full devotion. I have Given the meaning of both mantras as first time after meeting my guru my darkness has got dispelled and i have got somebody who has true insight of vedas.I consider my merit of past birth are propelling towards vedas and yoga. God in vedas has said learn vedas from a samadhist mantradrista yogi who has realised him and in whose heart vedas are originated. OM __________________ rashmi

12-14-2007, 01:31 PM	#55
Hubert sahásra Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Romania Posts: 1,173	Understanding the mantra mentally is one aspect, chanting is another (resonances) but the third and just as important (if not more important) aspect is not it's meaning but truly meaning it. Beleiveing-knowing that this way we actually talk to Divinity, and beleiveing-knowing that Divinity listens and talks to us also. I see mantra as prayer. Mantra yoga is the safest path, though a slow one. But the lasts often become the firsts ... I believe heaven is packed by mantra yogis, and hell is packed by fallen kundalini ones. __________________ "wahetever we deny or embrace, for worse or for better, we belong togheter" Pat Benatar

12-20-2007, 06:10 AM	#56
Rashmi shatá Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: india Posts: 127	Dear friends, namste, I have always told you that all the upnishads have come from vedas.there are some 18 major upnishads which a soul aspiring self realisation should read. These upnishads are the simple discourses given by mantradrishta rihis to make the disciple understand the subtle and lofty idels of veda on soul and God. One such upnishad is isha upnishad.The great siddha yogi Sai baba of shirdi how easily made his disciple understand the truth of this upnishad by taking real life example.This is long but do read it and enjoy the nectar of vedic wisdom which purifys the soul: Ishavasya Upanishad Das Ganu once started to write a Marathi commentary ont he Ishavasya Upanishad. Let us first give a brief idea of this Upanishad, before proceeding further. It is called a `Mantropanishad', as it is embodied in the Mantras of the Vedic Samhita. It constitutes the last or the 40th Chapter of the Vajasaneyi Samhita (Yajurveda) and it is, therefore, called Vajasaneyi Samhitopanishad. Being embodied in Vedic Samhitas, this is regarded as superior to all other Upanishads, which occur in the Brahmanas and Aranyakas (explanatory treatises on Martras and rituals). Not only this, other Upanishads are considered to be commentaries on the truths mentioned briefly in the Ishavasya Upanishad. For instance, the biggest of the Upanishads, viz, the Brihadaranyaka Upanishad, is considered by Pandit Satwalekar to be a running commentary on the Ishavasya Upanishad. Professor R.D. Ranade says:- "The Ishopanishad is quite a small Upanishad; and yet it contains many hints which show an extraordinarily piercing insight. Within the short compass of 18 verses, it gives a valuable mystical description of the Atman, a description of the ideal sage, who stands unruffled in the minds of temptations and sorrows; and adumbration of the doctrine of Karma-Yoga as later formulated, and finally a reconciliation of the claims of knowledge and works. The most valuable ideas, that lies at the root of the Upanishad, is that of a logical synthesis between the two opposites of knowledge; and work, which are both required according to the Upanishad to be annulled in a higher synthesis". (page 24 of the Constructive Survey of the Upanishad Philosophy). In another place he says that "The poetry of the Ishopanishad is a Commixture of moral, mystical and metaphysical (ibid, Page 41)". From the brief description given above about this Upanishad, any one can see how difficult it is to translate this Upanishad in a vernacular language, and brief out its exact meaning. Das Ganu translated it in Marathi 'Ovi'metre, verse by verse, but as he did not comprehend the gist or essence of the Upanishad, he was not satisfied with his performance. He therefore consulted some learned men regarding his doubts and difficulties and discussed with them at great length. They did not solve them nor did they give him any rational and satisfactory explanation. So Das Ganu was a little restless over this matter. SadGuru only competent and Qualified to Explain As we have seen, this Upanishad is the quintessence of the Vedas. It is the science of self-realization, it is the scythe or weapon which can rend asunder the bondage of life and death, and make us free. Therefore, he thought, that he who has himself attained self-realization, can only give him the true or correct interpretation of the Upanishad. When nobody could satisfy Das Ganu, he resolved to consult Sai Baba about this. When he got an opportunity to go to Shirdi, he saw Sai Baba, prostrated himself before Him, and mentioned his difficulties about the Ishavasya Upanishad and requested Him to give the correct solution. Sai Baba, blessed him and said- "You need not be anxious, there is no difficulty about the matter, the mind-servant of Kaka (Kakasaheb Dixit) will solve your doubts at Vile Parle, on your way home". The people who went present then and heard this, thought that Baba was joking and said, "How could an illiterate maid-servant solve the difficulties of this nature", but Das Garu thought otherwise. He was sure, that whatever Baba spoke, must come true, Baba's word was the decree of the Brahma (Almighty). Kaka's Maid-Servant On fully believing in Baba's words, he left Shirdi and came to Vile Parle (a suburb of Bombay), and stayed with Kakasaheb Dixit. There the next day, when Das Ganu was enjoying his morning nap (some say when he was engaged in worship), he heard a poor girl singing a beautiful song in clear and melodious tones. The subject matter of the song was a crimson coloured Sari, how nice it was, how fine was its embroidery, how beautiful were its ends and borders etc. He liked the song so much that he came out, and saw that it was being sung by a young girl, the sister of Namya, who was a servant of Kakasaheb. The girl was cleaning vessels, and had only a torn rag on her person. On seeing her impoverished condition, and her jovial temperament, Das Ganu felt pity for her and when Rao Bahadur M.V.Pradhan next day gave him a pair of dhotars, he requested him to give a sari to the poor little girl also. Rao Bahadur bought a good Chirdi (small Sari) and presented it to her. Like a starving person getting luckily good dishes to eat, her joy knew to bounds. Next day she wore the new Sari, and out of great joy and merriment, whirled, danced round and played `Fugadi' with other girls and excelled them all. The Day following, she kept the new Sari in her box at home and came with the old and torn rags, but she looked as merry as she did the previous day. On seeing this, Das Ganu's pity was transferred into admiration. He thought that the girl being poor had to wear a torn rag, but now she had a new Sari which she kept in reserve and putting on the old rag, strutted herself, showing no trace of sorrow or dejection. Thus he realized that all our feelings of pain and pleasure depend upon the attitude of our mind. On thinking deeply over this incident, he realized that a man ought to enjoy whatever God has bestowed on him in the firm conviction that He besets every thing, from behind and before, and on all sides and that whatever is bestowed on him by God must be for his good. In this particular case, the impoverished condition of the poor girl, her torn rag and the new Sari, the donor, the dance and the acceptance were all parts of the Lord and pervaded by Him. Hence, Das Ganu got a practical demonstration of the lesson of the Upanishad - the lesson of contentment with one's own lot in the belief that whatever happens, is ordained by God, and is ultimately good for us. Om __________________ rashmi

12-20-2007, 06:12 AM	#57
Rashmi shatá Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: india Posts: 127	Rest of the upnishads explanation for you Unique Method of Teaching From the above incident, the reader will see that Baba's method was unique and varied. Though Baba never left Shirdi, He sent some to Machhindragad, some to Kolhapur or Sholapur for practising sadhanas. To some He appeared in His usual form, to some He appeared in waking or dreaming state, day or night and satisfied their desires. It is impossible to describe all the methods, that Baba used in imparting instructions to His Bhaktas. In this particular case, He sent Das Ganu to Vile Parle, where he got his problem solved, through the maid-servant. To those, who say that it was not necessary to sent Das Ganu outside and that Baba could have personally taught him, we say that Baba followed the right or best course, or how else could Das Ganu would have learnt a great lesson, that the poor maid-servant and her Sari were pervaded by the Lord. Now we close the Chapter with another beautiful extract about this Upanishad. The Ethics of the Ishavasya Upanishad "One of the main features of the Ishavasya Upanishad, is the ethical advice it offers, and it is interesting to note that the ethics of the Upanishad are definitely based upon the meta-physical position advanced in it. The very opening words of the Upanishad tell us that God pervades every thing. As a corollary from this metaphysical position, the ethical advice it offers is, that a man ought to enjoy whatever God bestows on him in the firm belief, that as He pervades everything, whatever is bestowed on him by God must be good. It follows naturally, that the Upanishad should forbid us from coveting another man's property. In fact, we are fittingly taught here a lesson of contentment with one's own lot in the belief that whatever happens, it is divinely ordained and it is hence good for us. Another moral advice is, that man must spend his life-time always in doing action, specially the karmas enjoined in the Shastras, in a mood of believing resignation to His will. Inactivity, according to this Upanishad, would be the canker of the soul. It is only when a man spends his life-time on doing actions in this manner, that he can hope to attain the ideal of Naishkarmya. Finally, the text goes on to say that a man, who sees all beings in the Self and sees the Self as existing in all beings; in fact, for whom all beings and everything that exists have becomes the Self - how can such a man suffer infatuation? What ground would such a man have for grief? Loathfulness, infatuation and grief verily proceed from our not being able to see the Atman in all things. But a man, who realizes the oneness of all things, for whom everything has become the Self, must ipso facto, cease to be affected by the common foibles of humanity. (Page 169-170 of The Creative Period by Messrs. Belvalkar and Ranade). I hope we have gained some deep insight into vedas through this upnishad OM __________________ rashmi

12-22-2007, 09:07 PM	#58
Rashmi shatá Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: india Posts: 127	Dear friends , Namaste and wish you all merry Christmas, Now few more traditions of India which have roots in Vedas:- 1. Cow :- Hindus do not eat meat or slaughter Cows. God in Vedas has ordered human beings not to eat kill animals until they have turned ferocious and attack human beings.The tradition of shikar is to hunt ferocious animals who are posing threat to human beings, and have turned man eater.But present day people go for shikar and kill animals for pleasure. As souls get bodies of different animals bird, man, women etc as per deeds it performs. A soul is neither male nor female, it is genderless, it is indestructible.So to suffer from its deeds the body is given by the creator by killing others we are doing wrong. God in Vedas have told not to slaughter Cows especially as it is considered equivalent to brahma.So hindus do not kill cows and eat beef. 2. Creamation: Hindus burn the dead bodies in wooden pyre after death with veda mantras as per Vedas. This is the last sanskar to be performed for human body as per Vedas. This is called narmdehyajen. The ashes are immersed in flowing water.After thirteen days therahvee is to be kept . Now it is done as per the Vedas the explanation as per my Guruji I am giving: In Atharvaveda mantra 8/8/11 'Yamdut' means = 'YAM' means God, and 'dut' means storm, cyclone, flood, earthquake, heavy rains, etc., etc., in mantra the air is Yam. So when a soul is to leave a body then by the power of God sutratma air enters the body and takes the soul out of it then goes to Savita, etc. In 39th chapter of Yajurveda the process of this cremation is mentioned. This process is also called as "NARMEDH YAJYEN", "PURUSH MEDH YAJYEN" and "DAH KARAM" and "ANTEYESHATI KARAM". Atharvaveda mantra 10/8/26 says "YEH CHAKAR SAH JAJAR" means He (God) who makes the body, He destroys the same one day. Sense of Yajurveda mantra 39/5 is that when the soul leaves the body then the soul wanders in so many places, takes another body according to its previous deeds (karmas). Yajurveda mantra 39/6 says that the soul after leaving the body first day goes to Savita (sun), second day agnihi (fire), third Vaayu (normal air), fourth Aditya, fifth chandrma (moon), sixth ritu (seasons), seventh marutah, eighth brihaspati (tiniest air), ninth mitrah (breathing), tenth varunah (udan air), eleventh indrah (electricity), twelfth Vishvedevah (in all divine qualities). Then, after wandering in sky, gets body according to previous deeds. So these twelve days are completed, then after 13 days the soul takes another body. Rigveda mandal 10 sukta 135 says that normally soul after getting body faces the result of its past lives' deeds and under influence of illusion (duly attracted towards illusion) does sins and again gets birth to face the sins. The soul is immortal and always separate from body. When an aspirant meets with a learned Acharya and gets spiritual education, then the fourth mantra says that the soul gets salvation Mantra is APAANG PRAANGETI SWDHAYAA GRIBHITAH AMARTYO MARTYENAA SAYONIHI. TA SHASHVANTA VISHUCHINA VIYANTA NYA NYAM CHIKYURN NI CHIKYURNYAM. Soul according to its good or bad (APANGETI) takes bodies of animals, birds, insects etc., and (PRANG) bodies of Rishis, Munis, i.e., (uuch Yoni) best bodies after leaving the present body, the soul (SWDHAYAA GRIBHITAH) duly attached with its own power of taking birth according to pious deeds and sins, enters other bodies (AMARTAYAH) though the soul is away from death being immortal but after death of bodies, takes new bodies. These ideas of Vedas has very well been mentioned in Bhagwat Geeta shlok 2/20 wherein Yogeshwar Shri Krishna says (AJO NITYAH SHASHWATOAYAM PURAANNO NA HANYTE HANYAMANNE SHARIRE ) i.e., the soul is (AJAH NITAYAH SHASHWATOH) never takes birth and is eternal (NAHANYATE HANAYMANNE SHARIRE) in fact after death of body too soul is never dead being immortal. (TASHASHVANTA) this process of death and birth of bodies and souls is eternal. (VISHUCHINA VYANTA) soul and bodies goes far away to different directions [soul goes to Savita etc., {given below} according to Yajurveda chapter 39 and then takes birth and get another bodies and five elements of bodies goes to space and are mixed within air, fire etc., according to Yajurveda mantra 40/15] (ANYAM NICHIKYHU) many learned knows about this fact (ANYAM NICHIKYHU) another who are lack of knowledge of Vedas do not know the fact, i.e., we mostly know our body but not ourselves, i.e., soul. Death is sure i.e., the body will have to be cremated one day. Sanskar: Hindus especially Brahmins perform all the sanskar as per Vedas, as Vedas knowledge got limited to them in kaliyug. The sanskar as per Vedas to be performed for every soul taken birth as human beings are under the guidance of a learned Guru who knows Vedas because in every sanskar the havan is perforemed with Vedic mantras. These all were performed in Satyug, Dwapur, treta yuga and too by Shri Ram, Shri Krishna etc. 1. Garbhdhan Sanskar --- which is performed just after marriage and before pregnancy to have a good baby. 2. Punsvan sanskar ---which is peformed just after pregnancy of second or third month. 3. Seemantonnayan sanskar ---in 4th, 6th or in 8th month of pregnancy. 4. Jaatkaram Sanskar ---just after birth of a baby i.e., the same day. 5. Naamkaran sanskar ---after 101 days of birth in which name of the baby is announced. 6. Nishkraman sanskar--- when the mother and baby comes out of the house. In the 3rd or 4th month totravel or to go anywhere. 7. Annprasahn sanskar--- in the 6th month of the baby after birth on the same day of birth. In this sanskarthe baby is allowed to take solid food because up to 5th month baby had been taking milk/water only. 8. Churakaram sanskar i.e., Mundan sanskar---in the first or third year. 9. Karanvedh sanskar--- ear piercing ceremony. 10. Upnayan sanskar i.e., allowing baby to go school first time. 11. Vedaarambh sanskar i.e., to start study of Vedas in 6to 8 years. 12. Samavartan sanskar--- i.e., the baby has attained the knowledge of Vedas. It is performed in the age of fourteen years.13. Vivah sanskar i.e., marriage ceremony. 14. Vanprasth sanskar--- in the age of 51 plus. 15. Sanyas sanskar --- in the age of 75 plus or at any age when anyone becomes ascetic. 16. then the last, Anteshti sanskar when death comes. This sanskar is of dead body i.e., cremation Aswamedh yajen: These yajen was performed by lord Krishna, rama etc and all great ancient kings as per Vedas. It does not mean horses are to be slaughtered as explained by Maxmuller and other western scholars and offered in yajen. It is a mistake to interpret Vedas as per words. It actually is : The meaning of Ashwamedh Yaj is, "to perform the Yaj for the benefit of the nation". Here the literal meaning of ashwa in Vedas is nation and not horse. Rigveda mantra 5/27/5 states that the person who wishes to obtain chakravarti rajya (to be monarch), he organizes Ashwamedh Yaj. In the Yaj he listens the Vedic mantra and do Yajyen by controlling his senses, organs and mind. Rigveda mantra 5/27/6 states that king and his public must organize Ashwamedh Yaj i.e., to build a long live strong kingdom. In this way king must depute learned acharya of Vedas to spread the knowledge of Vedas all over the nation, so that the people must be learned to be away from illusion and sins and must obey the rules and regulations etc., etc. Ideally the king must himself organize Yaj and more and more wherein he must sit to listen the Vedas, especially the subject, "how to rule", so that a strong, happy, rich and long live nation is built. So Ashwamedh means nation. Ashwamaed Yaj is performed by a strong king. The main benefit of the Yajyen is that it gives long-life to the entire nation. A horse also is prepared as a part of Yajyen (if done by the king) and is set to roam free. It showcases the power of the king. To challenge rule of a king one has to hold the horse. He has to protect the Ashwa, the horse. In the Ashwamedh Yaj special Ved mantras are chanted in the Yaj and aahuti are offered. In the Ved mantras the prayer is done from the core of heart, that in the nation Brahmin, Kshatriye, Vaishya and Shudra are born to protect the nation well. Cow, bullock, horse and some strong character-full ladies, girls are born. Pious desires are fulfilled, timely rains occur, the public live long happy life. So the Ashwamedh Yaj is specially organised by the strong king for the benefit of the public. Mantras offered in Ashwamedh Yajyen will bring peace to the nation. Ashwamedh Yaj which is the best Yaj, is organized by a strong king for the benefit of the Yaj/nation. However, you can organize Yaj for the peace in nation for three days, five days or seven days. OM __________________ rashmi

12-22-2007, 09:16 PM	#59
Rashmi shatá Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: india Posts: 127	Casteism and Vedas:This was ploy used by britishers and Christian missionaries to destroy the ancestral heritage of India. The varnna (caste system) to be considered by birth has been made by us post mahabharat war but originally the varnna (Brahmin, kshatriya, Vaishya, Shudra) based on their deeds and not by birth has been made by God, as is also mentioned in Yajurveda mantra 31/11. Secondly, God does not permit to hate anybody on the earth and those who do, they commit sins. So as per the said Ved mantra, if a Brahmin's boy does not gain Vedic knowledge and thus does not follow the path of Vedas but shows activity of a Kshatriya then according to Vedas, he is Kshatriya and not Brahmin and if Kshatriya gains the quality of Brahmin, he will be Brahmin not Kshatriya. So is the case of rest of the varnnas.Examples are Rishi Vishwamitra who was a king later on he acquired knowledge of Vedas and realized God and became brahmarishi, the nava naths etc. Gotra system: People in ancient times has formulated this system to maintain lineage.The disiples and sons of rishis after receiving education went to other places and kept name of rishis as gotra to identify from which rishi they have got knowledge and so on. Like people of kashyap Gotra are from the lineage of Kashay rishi, similarly having vashistha as gotra means you are from lineage of vashistha rishi. People from same gotra do not marry as they are considered brother and sister and as per Vedas brother and sister should not marry. Temple and idol worship: As per Vedas god is formless.He is to be worshipped by yajen andrealised by astanga yoga practice as per samaveda. As matter of fact, idol worship started when Buddhism and Jainism came into existence. The God's worship is in Vedas which emanate direct from God, wherein idol worship is not mentioned. So, on the basis of the qualities of the God, as mentioned in Vedas, God is known and when an aspirant follows/obeys the path of Vedas i.e., worship, Ashtang yoga practice, listening of Vedas, Yajyen etc., under guidance of an acharya, then he attains Samadhi i.e., realizes God too. So, as per Vedas, no need of idol worship. If someone believes that God is everywhere then why does he avoid wine, smoking, theft, etc., etc. inside the temple and does outside? Actually realization is subject of deep study of Vedas and to observe thereon. Sagunn means with eternal qualities mentioned in Ved mantras because the meaning of Sa+Gunn means 'with qualities'. So God has unlimited qualities like formless, omnipresent, etc., etc. and nirakar means shapeless. One can not break the rules and regulations of God mentioned in Vedas. Vedas are self-proof and cannot be denied. As per my Guru Ji. How present day all siddha yogis are worshipped . Famous pilgrimage places are associated with these great yogis where they have Done hard tapasya, penance, astanga yoga practice and realized God. That’s the reason when you go to these ancient temples and ask a wish with sincerity and devotion it gets fulfilled by there power of God realization a.Ex sabrimala with Lord Ayappa, shiva ji, rama, Krishna etc, 12 Jyotirlingas, shrines of vaishnao Devi, etc.Gods and Goddess are siddha realised beings may have celestial form earlier i have told in my post where swami Nityananda has said. Similarly the belief of Hindus that God is present in every being, worshipping trees etc Brahma is every where is as per vedas. Further food is offered to God first as food itself is considered brahmam, further GOD should be remembered first as per vedas. Hindus First offer every thing to God as he is the reason for us and ever present, beyond destruction unlike us. Further many siddha yogis or realised souls have taken birth time and again and told us the importance of everything, so all those also got added and then this tradition has emerged over a pretty long time as i have told you earlier. So this ends my understanding of indian tradition after studting vedas. Om __________________ rashmi

12-23-2007, 05:33 AM	#60
Hubert sahásra Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Romania Posts: 1,173	It is always delightful to read your posts, Rashmi. I also believe God is in everything ... and this is why I am confused by the meaning of transsubstantiation in Eucharist. I believe any bread, any food we eat is the body of Christ. (As God is in everything, or should I just say God is everything). If you believe this, the theory of transsubstantiation is unnecessary. But I still accept the cerebration of the ritual as a from of worship, as a special moment what evokes the feeling of mystery in the hearts of believers. __________________ "wahetever we deny or embrace, for worse or for better, we belong togheter" Pat Benatar

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