Herniated disc

Questioner · 04-26-2002, 10:19 PM

I have been studying some of the books written by Viniyoga teachers and I notice in some books Utthita Trikonasana is performed with the feet pointing forward. I was taught that one foot turns out to 90 degrees and the other in 15 degrees. My questions if not whether one is right or wrong but the effects to the structure of each. My understanding is if the feet are pointing forward you slightly come forward before going to the side to place the hand on the floor. In trying this I find if I don't go slightly forward the hand won't reach the floor as the pelvis and ribcage come into contact with each other. I also would like to know which method you would consider safer in general and especially with those who have sacrum or low back problems. It would seem to me with one foot turned out the sacrum is more vulnerable.

I have a student who has a herniated disc. I am a new teacher and am not too informed on how to proceed. I have been told that those with disc herniation should not do strong forward bends or lateral bends. If this is the case, is there something they can do as an alternative while the class is doing these types of poses that can help his/their condition.

Thanks you for your help. Sharon

Mukunda · 04-26-2002, 10:22 PM

Good question and well framed. Indeed the point is not how to do the pose but rather what is happening to the body in the manner in which the body does it. Changing the way in which they do yogasanas benefits many people with postural misalignments or injuries. I feel it is safest to look carefully at the student and assure that they are not harmed, stressed or aggravated but helped by this potentially beneficial practice.

I agree that when Triangle pose is taught with the feet facing forward it is safer for students whose sacral or lumbar areas have been strained. In analyzing the motions this variation allows for two motions. Lateral flexion of the spine is 45 degrees and abduction of the hip joints is also 45 degrees. When the ribs come into contact with the iliac pelvis, lateral flexion has reached its fullest motion. Abduction is complete when the hamstrings and abductors (outer thighs) feel the fullness of the motion. Compared to practice where the feet are turned to the angles you indicate which will enable full flexion of the hip joints, which is 90 degrees. In this pose the spine does not go into lateral flexion but remains neutral, hip abduction is permitted. As a result the hand can come farther down towards the floor.

The major motion to give students with herniated disc is mild backbending such as locust or sunbird (Chakravakasana – leg lifting from cat pose), one leg at a time. The most common herniation is L4-5 disc moving to the right side (80%) therefore usually locust lifting the right leg as you extend the leg provides the most relief.

Questioner · 04-27-2002, 02:08 AM

I thought backbends were contraindicated with disc herniation. Is it really beneficial to do gentle backbends like Salabhasana? And are forward bends with knees bent okay?

Mukunda · 04-27-2002, 02:09 AM

Yes this is the general rule however I find nearly all students benefit from locust as long as they learn to decompress before they lift the legs. The legs must be reaching backward during the poses. Some students can even do cobra with no problem. Bending forward with knees bent is often OK. However, i would not even give this for someone who is having active discomfort and not able to walk upright.

Questioner · 04-27-2002, 02:09 AM

Thanks for your clarification Mukunda. Just wondering one more thing. The pose that I learned as locust (Salabhasana) was taught with the hands clasped under the pelvis and both legs lifting (Sivananda yoga). In Kripalu yoga and other traditions a posture I learned as Navasana (upward facing boat) is called locust. This is lengthening and lifting both legs and arms. I often use a warm up where we lift alternate arms and legs while lengthening out through the toes and the fingers. Is this what you are referring to when you mention a gentle backbend that's beneficial for people with disc herniation? Thanks in advance.

Mukunda · 04-27-2002, 02:11 AM

What I am referring to is Salabhasana as in my book. Similar to Sivananda method just not such a strong effort for lifting. The effort is on extending, reaching the legs backward, not going for height. Navasana (or Kripalu locust) is potentially good if lumbar spine can be brought forward and not rounded. The problem motions with herniated disc are spinal flexion, rounding during forward bends, which will make the herniation protrude even farther. Discs almost inevitably tend to herniate posteriorly.

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04-26-2002, 10:19 PM	#1
Questioner Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 479	I have been studying some of the books written by Viniyoga teachers and I notice in some books Utthita Trikonasana is performed with the feet pointing forward. I was taught that one foot turns out to 90 degrees and the other in 15 degrees. My questions if not whether one is right or wrong but the effects to the structure of each. My understanding is if the feet are pointing forward you slightly come forward before going to the side to place the hand on the floor. In trying this I find if I don't go slightly forward the hand won't reach the floor as the pelvis and ribcage come into contact with each other. I also would like to know which method you would consider safer in general and especially with those who have sacrum or low back problems. It would seem to me with one foot turned out the sacrum is more vulnerable. I have a student who has a herniated disc. I am a new teacher and am not too informed on how to proceed. I have been told that those with disc herniation should not do strong forward bends or lateral bends. If this is the case, is there something they can do as an alternative while the class is doing these types of poses that can help his/their condition. Thanks you for your help. Sharon

04-26-2002, 10:22 PM	#2
Mukunda SYTherapy Creator Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 1,068	Good question and well framed. Indeed the point is not how to do the pose but rather what is happening to the body in the manner in which the body does it. Changing the way in which they do yogasanas benefits many people with postural misalignments or injuries. I feel it is safest to look carefully at the student and assure that they are not harmed, stressed or aggravated but helped by this potentially beneficial practice. I agree that when Triangle pose is taught with the feet facing forward it is safer for students whose sacral or lumbar areas have been strained. In analyzing the motions this variation allows for two motions. Lateral flexion of the spine is 45 degrees and abduction of the hip joints is also 45 degrees. When the ribs come into contact with the iliac pelvis, lateral flexion has reached its fullest motion. Abduction is complete when the hamstrings and abductors (outer thighs) feel the fullness of the motion. Compared to practice where the feet are turned to the angles you indicate which will enable full flexion of the hip joints, which is 90 degrees. In this pose the spine does not go into lateral flexion but remains neutral, hip abduction is permitted. As a result the hand can come farther down towards the floor. The major motion to give students with herniated disc is mild backbending such as locust or sunbird (Chakravakasana – leg lifting from cat pose), one leg at a time. The most common herniation is L4-5 disc moving to the right side (80%) therefore usually locust lifting the right leg as you extend the leg provides the most relief.

04-27-2002, 02:08 AM	#3
Questioner Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 479	I thought backbends were contraindicated with disc herniation. Is it really beneficial to do gentle backbends like Salabhasana? And are forward bends with knees bent okay?

04-27-2002, 02:09 AM	#4
Mukunda SYTherapy Creator Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 1,068	Yes this is the general rule however I find nearly all students benefit from locust as long as they learn to decompress before they lift the legs. The legs must be reaching backward during the poses. Some students can even do cobra with no problem. Bending forward with knees bent is often OK. However, i would not even give this for someone who is having active discomfort and not able to walk upright.

04-27-2002, 02:11 AM	#6
Mukunda SYTherapy Creator Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 1,068	What I am referring to is Salabhasana as in my book. Similar to Sivananda method just not such a strong effort for lifting. The effort is on extending, reaching the legs backward, not going for height. Navasana (or Kripalu locust) is potentially good if lumbar spine can be brought forward and not rounded. The problem motions with herniated disc are spinal flexion, rounding during forward bends, which will make the herniation protrude even farther. Discs almost inevitably tend to herniate posteriorly.