Tight shoulders

[FlexPenguin]

When I first started yoga I could barely reach my arm around my back. 30 years of bench presses, military presses, and a shoulder break 10 years ago have contributed to very tight shoulder/upper back. I know this is very common in men in general.

I have improved considerably and can do unassisted back bends (still need the blocks against a wall for leverage) and Marichyasana A. On Monday I bound with my big toe (on one side only) in Ardha Baddha Padma for the first time.

I'm still having great difficulty in Prasarita Padttanasana C as my hands pull apart and my shoulders resist and want to move forward. Also, in downward dog I am positively amphibian in the arms and shoulders. My instructor tries to bring my elbows forward and release my shoulders, but it feels very uncomfortable and even a little painful in that position.

I've started taking some Iyengar classes once a week and it is helping. But, any suggestions 'off the mat' to help with this?

[InnerAthlete]

Hello Flex, or unflex as the case may be

Yes tight shoulders appear to be more common in men, though it depends fully on the lifestyle, path, work, and processing they've done. So it is not inherently so. But as you point out it is the culmination of choices, not gender.

"Doing" unassisted backbends is far less critical than doing backbends (of any sort) with integrity in the physical body. But that's not the point of your post.

You're asking about a pose from the Ashtanga series. And as I've said here numerous times, this should first be posed to the teacher that has been selected by the student. Of course if that were always the case I'm not sure there'd be much of a yoga forum

Frankly, if the body is not ready for a pose, or a segment of the body is not ready, then try it, of course. But generally not ready is not ready. The yoga that I share with others is not ashtanga yoga. However if I had a student in class with this issue in this pose I would first suggest holding a yoga belt between the hands.

I'd also like to point out that there are precursory poses, actions, philosophy, warmings, etcetera that lead up to doing the pose you mention. Perhaps those are built in to the sequence and perhaps they are not. It is not for me to say. So again for my students we do several things specifically to open the shoulders in preparation for such a pose.

You ask about "off the mat". Yes there are things to do off the mat. The first is to make life choices that do not place the weight of the world on your shoulders. The second is to process, through meditation, your response to that weight of the world (when you are unable or unwilling to un-choose it).

The diet and lifestyle we teach in Purna Yoga™ teaches us that altering what we do with our bodies, how we do it, and what we put into it to nourish it also has effect on the the body's systems.

Do shoulder opening poses (not ones that require openness)
Stay hydrated, alkaline, and oxygenated in your eating
Meditate and see what you are still bearing
Rub organic, untoasted sesame seed oil on the deltoids morning and night.

These things, when done from a sound intention and done with sincerity, will be very helpful.

[FlexPenguin]

Originally Posted by InnerAthlete

You ask about "off the mat". Yes there are things to do off the mat. The first is to make life choices that do not place the weight of the world on your shoulders. The second is to process, through meditation, your response to that weight of the world (when you are unable or unwilling to un-choose it).

I'm working at that. I've been in leadership roles all my life and, although I can more than carry the 'weight', I'm at a point in my life where I wish to step aside. My personal coach is trying to guide me, but old habits die hard.

I picked up a strap and use it daily. My progress has been satisfying, but more to go. Still, yoga practice has taken 5 strokes off my golf game

[Bridgette]

Tight shoulders is fairly prevalent in today's society. Look how an individuals typing for example. The shoulders are rolled foreword typically. Do this for a good 5 hours a day add in the posture problems that come from sitting in inappropriate chairs and we've got a multitude of issues.

A lot of people find when they start targeting the shoulders, you start to find ease in back bends such as natrajasana & eka pada rajakapotasana. Not to mention some of the postures you mentioned. I usually do a series of 2 asanas for the shoulder girdle and stress holding the postures for an extended period of time even if that means coming out of the posture for a brief break and bringing yourself back into it. (Ideally for 3-4 minutes at least)

Gomukhasana - Cow Faced Posture: Use a strap at first and work your way towards no strap. While the full posture includes the leg placement, if the area we are trying to target is the shoulders we can work simply with the arm stretch and gradually move into working in the leg placement. Otherwise work with the arm placement in vajrasana

Garudaasana - Eagle Posture: This is one of my favorite balance postures! The placement of the arms will be difficult at first if you have tight shoulders but work with it a little each day. By bringing the arms foreword you will notice a deeper stretch. a lot of students say it feels like a deep tissue massage for the upper back. As before, feel free to work with the arm placement before bringing in the full leg placements. I'd recommend holding the arms in the garudaasana posture for about 3 minutes (once again feel free to come out of the posture and bring yourself back into it when comfortable) and during the last minute try to incorprate the legs as well.

Stay persistent and remember to practice daily on a regular basis. The shoulder girdle is one of the the most fascinating areas to work with and with dilgant practice it provides a great deal of range of motion. Good luck and breathe deep.

[lashannasmall]

Be careful with your teacher messing with your shoulders. You can really get injured that way. I wouldn't worry about the shoulders. It took you a lifetime to get those shoulders and it may take you a lifetime to get rid of them. Patience.

[FlexPenguin]

Originally Posted by lashannasmall

Be careful with your teacher messing with your shoulders. You can really get injured that way. I wouldn't worry about the shoulders. It took you a lifetime to get those shoulders and it may take you a lifetime to get rid of them. Patience.

Hopefully only half a lifetime.

Bridgette - Thanks for the suggestions. I enjoy the eagle posture and can get my shoulders to cooperate. Cow face is the one that is most challenging, probably because my shoulder needs to rotate outward and back to get into that one. Easily practiced at home while watching TV with a strap.

This also prevents me from getting into headstands and forearm stands unassisted. Getting the hinge action in my shoulders so that my upper arms and spine are alligned - then I can allow bandhas to elevate my legs, which is not difficult for me.

[tessiesasha]

The shoulders is a mysterious thing. I have no problems doing Marichyasana A - D but any upward rotations simply kills me. So any asanas that involve the shoulders are major challenges. Have begin using a strap recently and am able to do headstand, handstand and forearm balances but needs a lot of stretching prior to these poses. But I still can't do wheel with straight arms.

Right now Pigeon pose still look like mission impossible but hey as they say it's the journey that counts not the destination.

[InnerAthlete]

I don't believe the upper arms and spine are aligned in Sirsasana, Flex. The humerus is typically ~45º to the floor rather than 90º.

[FlexPenguin]

Thanks IA. Check out this picture. I have great diffuculty getting my shoulders to hinge into that position where (from the side view) the elbows are (almost) directly below the shoulders following in a line up the spine to the hips, knees, ankles.

The instruction I have been given suggests I create the proper base and walk my feet forward until my shoulders are in the proper position, then I can lightly lift my legs. I'm getting closer, but still need help. I've been working on forearm stands as an alternative.

[InnerAthlete]

I stand corrected. In said practitioner 65º not 45º.
If it is the pictured position of this person's should joints that pose the difficulty then I'd imagine you've been directed in ways to open up the shoulders. However I'd like to point out that the line (plane) you reference does not, in said photo, contain the anatomical parts you mention

[FlexPenguin]

Originally Posted by InnerAthlete

If it is the pictured position of this person's should joints that pose the difficulty then I'd imagine you've been directed in ways to open up the shoulders.

I've made huge strides since I first started this thread.

[tessiesasha]

Originally Posted by FlexPenguin

I've made huge strides since I first started this thread.

Good for you!

Me, I am still struggling to straighten my arms in wheel pose and the recent diagnosis of rheumatoid arthritis, makes it even more challenging. I shall, nevertheless, shoulder on.

[tessiesasha]

bought a yoga chair last week to enhance the opening of the shoulder and back. the strange thing is that lying with the back on the seat with arms outstretched for about 3 mins actually helps to chase the blues away.

[InnerAthlete]

That's not strange at all Tessie. Backbends are well known for assisting in depression issues.

[Alix]

Originally Posted by InnerAthlete

That's not strange at all Tessie. Backbends are well known for assisting in depression issues.

I didn't know that. Are there particular backbends that are better than others?

[Techne]

From my experience, go for ones you can manage to squeeze out while depressed and that you simultaneously don't overdo in your low back. Like this morning I reclined over a rolled up blanket (just below my shoulder blades, belly facing up) to repair a lot of my attitude from a fitful night's sleep.

[InnerAthlete]

Originally Posted by Alix

I didn't know that. Are there particular backbends that are better than others?

What do you mean by "better"?
You mean ones that are more effective??

No. They vary from person to person.
And I'd like to reinforce what was said earlier.
They should be done such that there is no over doing in the lumbar spine.

Some students do find a back bending sequence to be more effective than a back bending posture.

[FlexPenguin]

Originally Posted by InnerAthlete

That's not strange at all Tessie. Backbends are well known for assisting in depression issues.

Why is that? Are some glands stimulated to release natural mood-enhancing chemicals to our brain? Or is there something else?
Serious question.

[greenoro0]

Try to stretch your shoulder

[InnerAthlete]

@Flex
There are both physiological and energetic "reasons" and they are likely intertwined.
I personally try to balance my own desire to know why with a caution to not get too wrapped up in those things. When allowing the first to run unchecked the practice becomes one too rooted in rational thought or logic (mental force). A rampant run of the second can lack discernment and cause harm.

From the yogic perspective (not to dismiss science as it is a crucial part of validating yoga thus far) we are each a petri dish for our own experimentation -with the added bonus of some very bright and dedicated masters having come before us.

[Alix]

Originally Posted by InnerAthlete

What do you mean by "better"?
You mean ones that are more effective??

No. They vary from person to person.
And I'd like to reinforce what was said earlier.
They should be done such that there is no over doing in the lumbar spine.

Some students do find a back bending sequence to be more effective than a back bending posture.

IA, I'm sorry, I meant more effective. I work with adolescents and teach a relaxation class. I use some asana before I work them into guided meditation and visualization and I'm having a lot of success with the class. I don't want to add any intense backbends, but cobra and childs pose are not out of the question. I'd love to have a couple of poses and counterposes to help these adolescents with their depression.

FlexPenguin, I'm sorry, I didn't mean to hijack your thread. Perhaps if anyone has a reply for me they could send it via PM or let me know and I'll start a new thread?

[InnerAthlete]

@ Alix

Balasana is a pose of introspection. Its very nature takes the consciousness in toward the heart center for reflection. Unfortunately, it is used merely as a "rest stop" in faster paced asana practices. I personally would be cautious in using forward bending postures for students dealing with depression.

Bhujangasana might be effective or the less intense Sarpasana. With the former, students will need to be directed such that the curve of the pose is not in the lumbar spine (beyond its inherent curve) and encouraged to draw the thoracic spine forward toward the sternum without violence or aggression.

Setu Bhanda may also work though its focus is lower in the spine than the two aforementioned poses. Here students will need to understand that there is absolutely no movement of the head while in the pose.

[Alix]

Thank you IA, I'll incorporate all those. I think bhujangasana is the easiest for my kids to do. I'll get them doing setu bhanda too.